1 00:00:00,500 --> 00:00:03,066 Trinity Hooper: Hello, everybody, and welcome to A Conversation 2 00:00:03,066 --> 00:00:06,466 with Cornel West, curated by Moorpark's 3 00:00:06,466 --> 00:00:10,699 BSU. The Q&A box is open for questions and 4 00:00:10,700 --> 00:00:12,900 there will be captions for anyone who needs it. 5 00:00:13,300 --> 00:00:15,533 This event will be live streamed on YouTube and 6 00:00:15,533 --> 00:00:17,633 the recording of this event will be available at a 7 00:00:17,633 --> 00:00:20,899 later date. This is coordinated by President 8 00:00:20,900 --> 00:00:23,733 Gerald Richardson the Third, Pauline Nassar, who is 9 00:00:23,733 --> 00:00:26,866 Chief Executive, Ka Ren MacCalla, Director of 10 00:00:26,866 --> 00:00:29,899 Public Affairs and Marketing, and me, Trinity Hooper, 11 00:00:29,900 --> 00:00:33,733 the Director of Secretarial Affairs and Treasury. This 12 00:00:33,733 --> 00:00:37,099 event is sponsored by the Moorpark College Student 13 00:00:37,100 --> 00:00:40,900 Equity, Associate Students of Ventura College, 14 00:00:41,166 --> 00:00:44,432 Associated Students of Moorpark College, Oxnard 15 00:00:44,433 --> 00:00:47,299 College Associated Student Government, and a 16 00:00:47,300 --> 00:00:50,233 special thanks is going out to Johnny Conley, 17 00:00:50,233 --> 00:00:52,633 Director of Student Equity and Moorpark College, 18 00:00:53,033 --> 00:00:55,633 Libby Fatta, Student Activity Specialist at 19 00:00:55,633 --> 00:00:58,699 Ventura College, Gabi Rodriguez, Student 20 00:00:58,700 --> 00:01:01,933 Activity Specialist at Moorpark College, the Black 21 00:01:01,933 --> 00:01:04,933 History Month Committee at Moorpark College, 22 00:01:04,933 --> 00:01:08,033 Professor Timothy Lumas, Ms. Banea Sumpter, 23 00:01:08,466 --> 00:01:11,499 Professor Ranford Hopkins, Professor Cynthia 24 00:01:11,500 --> 00:01:15,233 Barnett, Professor Tamarra Coleman, Professor Patty 25 00:01:15,233 --> 00:01:18,666 Colman, Professor Lauren Snowden, Micaiah 26 00:01:18,666 --> 00:01:22,466 Satterwhite, Dina Pielaet, Michael Ashton, and 27 00:01:22,466 --> 00:01:27,066 Analisa Jugan. Now, I would like to introduce Dr. 28 00:01:27,400 --> 00:01:28,000 Julius Sokenu. 29 00:01:32,500 --> 00:01:34,566 Dr. Julius Sokenu: Welcome, everyone, and thank you so much for 30 00:01:34,566 --> 00:01:38,099 joining us. I understand that there is almost seven 31 00:01:38,100 --> 00:01:40,000 or eight hundred people here, this 32 00:01:40,000 --> 00:01:43,200 afternoon, joining us. This afternoon's 33 00:01:43,200 --> 00:01:45,900 conversation with Dr. Cornel West is an 34 00:01:45,900 --> 00:01:49,033 opportunity to bear witness, to love and justice. 35 00:01:49,800 --> 00:01:53,066 Equitable access to higher education, facilitates 36 00:01:53,066 --> 00:01:56,299 social and economic mobility and fosters 37 00:01:56,300 --> 00:02:00,133 corrective justice. We are thoughtful in how we 38 00:02:00,133 --> 00:02:04,166 pursue student success by designing an ecosystem 39 00:02:04,400 --> 00:02:08,233 that promotes justice. Equity is a way of being, 40 00:02:08,566 --> 00:02:12,666 thinking, and acting. We go beyond just identifying 41 00:02:12,666 --> 00:02:16,832 data, but by addressing how our practices serve 42 00:02:16,833 --> 00:02:20,366 our students, our Black, our Indigenous, people of 43 00:02:20,366 --> 00:02:23,432 color students, our LGBTQ students, and our 44 00:02:23,433 --> 00:02:26,366 differently abled students. We go beyond 45 00:02:26,366 --> 00:02:29,066 identifying the gaps in hiring faculty and staff 46 00:02:29,300 --> 00:02:33,833 and create opportunities to advance and remain in 47 00:02:33,833 --> 00:02:35,866 our institutions, opportunites for those 48 00:02:35,866 --> 00:02:37,332 individuals to advance and remain in our 49 00:02:37,333 --> 00:02:41,933 institutions. Equity and inclusion for us means 50 00:02:42,133 --> 00:02:44,499 financial aid for our students, child care for our 51 00:02:44,500 --> 00:02:46,766 students, providing transportation opportunities 52 00:02:46,933 --> 00:02:49,766 for our students and our community, meeting the 53 00:02:49,766 --> 00:02:52,066 basic needs of our students so that they can 54 00:02:52,066 --> 00:02:55,932 achieve academic and career success. Following the 55 00:02:55,933 --> 00:02:58,733 brutal murder of George Floyd and the racial 56 00:02:58,933 --> 00:03:01,999 reckoning movement that followed, California 57 00:03:02,000 --> 00:03:05,133 Community College Chancellor Oakley called us to 58 00:03:05,133 --> 00:03:08,666 action. He challenged us to address the national 59 00:03:08,666 --> 00:03:12,732 crisis of racism and social inequity. Today's 60 00:03:12,733 --> 00:03:15,899 event is a conversation that is student led and 61 00:03:15,900 --> 00:03:19,366 supported by faculty and staff. We will have an 62 00:03:19,366 --> 00:03:23,399 honest, open discussion to address race and equity. 63 00:03:24,133 --> 00:03:27,766 Dr. West is the Oracle we look to, as we call out 64 00:03:27,766 --> 00:03:30,899 structural barriers to creating an equitable 65 00:03:30,900 --> 00:03:34,333 institution and achieving equitable 66 00:03:34,333 --> 00:03:38,133 transformation. Dr. West is an elder to help us 67 00:03:38,133 --> 00:03:41,366 build the cultural mindset, the shifts that are 68 00:03:41,366 --> 00:03:44,699 necessary to continuously reflect and hold 69 00:03:44,700 --> 00:03:48,933 ourselves accountable for creating an anti-racist, 70 00:03:49,100 --> 00:03:52,533 culturally responsive, and race conscious campus. 71 00:03:53,133 --> 00:03:55,633 Our student organizations at Moorpark, Ventura, and 72 00:03:55,633 --> 00:03:59,633 Oxnard College have collaborated today to present 73 00:03:59,633 --> 00:04:03,533 this talk with Dr. West. I am inspired by students, 74 00:04:03,766 --> 00:04:08,132 their advocacy, and we are here to learn, to listen, 75 00:04:08,433 --> 00:04:12,833 and to get motivated to act, and in so doing, bear 76 00:04:12,833 --> 00:04:16,366 witness to love and justice. My colleague, 77 00:04:16,366 --> 00:04:19,166 President Sanchez, sent his 78 00:04:19,166 --> 00:04:21,766 welcome and he was unable to join us this 79 00:04:21,766 --> 00:04:24,399 afternoon because they have a PRT visit going 80 00:04:24,400 --> 00:04:26,500 on their campus, but he does say his welcome, 81 00:04:27,066 --> 00:04:31,032 nevertheless. From Ventura College to express her 82 00:04:31,033 --> 00:04:33,433 welcome is Dr. Kim Hoffmans. 83 00:04:33,433 --> 00:04:34,633 Dr. Kim Hoffmans: Thank you, Dr. 84 00:04:34,633 --> 00:04:37,599 Sokenu, I really appreciate the opportunity to be here, 85 00:04:37,833 --> 00:04:41,133 and I thank Dr. West and all the presenters that 86 00:04:41,233 --> 00:04:45,766 are now enhancing all the wonderful presentations 87 00:04:45,766 --> 00:04:48,466 and conversations we've had all month around Black 88 00:04:48,466 --> 00:04:53,599 History Month. I also want to point out that 89 00:04:53,600 --> 00:04:56,633 our students and our employees deserve a learning 90 00:04:56,633 --> 00:05:01,333 environment that is inclusive of equity and free 91 00:05:01,333 --> 00:05:04,133 of racism. And that is important work that we're 92 00:05:04,133 --> 00:05:06,633 all doing, and why these conversations that we're 93 00:05:06,633 --> 00:05:09,466 having today and we've had all month and that will 94 00:05:09,466 --> 00:05:13,566 continue are so important. Lastly, I just want to 95 00:05:13,566 --> 00:05:16,232 thank our students. We are so blessed and 96 00:05:16,233 --> 00:05:20,699 fortunate to have students that are allies and 97 00:05:21,300 --> 00:05:25,133 partners in this work that they really are sharing 98 00:05:25,133 --> 00:05:27,966 their voices and their experience to help shape 99 00:05:27,966 --> 00:05:31,199 our colleges as we move forward in the future in 100 00:05:31,200 --> 00:05:34,400 supporting diversity, equity, inclusion. So we are 101 00:05:34,400 --> 00:05:37,833 very lucky at Ventura, Oxnard, and Moorpark College 102 00:05:38,033 --> 00:05:41,166 to have those partnerships and work together for 103 00:05:41,166 --> 00:05:43,699 institutional transformation. Thank you so much 104 00:05:43,700 --> 00:05:47,833 for allowing me to be here today. And then next, I 105 00:05:47,833 --> 00:05:50,166 think is, trustee from the Ventura 106 00:05:50,166 --> 00:05:52,866 County Community College District and our board 107 00:05:52,866 --> 00:05:54,666 chair, Josh Chancer. 108 00:05:58,800 --> 00:06:01,733 Josh Chancer: Good afternoon. On behalf of our elected board of 109 00:06:01,733 --> 00:06:04,899 trustees, welcome Dr. West, and I just wanted to 110 00:06:04,900 --> 00:06:07,366 say a huge thank you to the students of Oxnard, 111 00:06:07,366 --> 00:06:10,432 Ventura, and Moorpark College. You are truly the 112 00:06:10,433 --> 00:06:13,166 light of our district, and I'm very proud to hand 113 00:06:13,166 --> 00:06:15,632 it off to Miss MacCalla. Thank you. 114 00:06:17,933 --> 00:06:21,233 Ka Ren MacCalla: Hello, thank you. My name is Ka Ren MacCalla, I am 115 00:06:21,233 --> 00:06:23,733 the Director of Public Affairs and Marketing of 116 00:06:23,733 --> 00:06:26,433 the Moorpark College Black Student Union and also 117 00:06:27,000 --> 00:06:30,866 SS Triple C Region six Vice Chair. I would like to 118 00:06:30,866 --> 00:06:33,666 first introduce our co moderators, Gerald 119 00:06:33,666 --> 00:06:35,999 Richardson the Third, who is the President of the 120 00:06:36,166 --> 00:06:39,499 Moorpark College Black Student Union, the Senate 121 00:06:39,500 --> 00:06:43,166 Chair for Oxnard College ASD, and the Legislative 122 00:06:43,166 --> 00:06:46,932 Affairs Director of SS Triple C. Pauline Nassar is the 123 00:06:46,933 --> 00:06:49,599 Chief Director of Moorpark College BSU, SS 124 00:06:49,600 --> 00:06:52,266 Triple C Communications Officer, and Oxnard College 125 00:06:52,266 --> 00:06:54,699 Associated Student Senator, our faculty 126 00:06:54,700 --> 00:06:57,533 moderator, who is Tamarra Coleman, she is the DEI 127 00:06:57,533 --> 00:07:00,766 Coordinator on campus. And now for our legendary 128 00:07:00,766 --> 00:07:02,899 key note, Dr. Cornel West. 129 00:07:05,500 --> 00:07:08,666 Dr. Cornel West: Thank you for those very kind and generous words. 130 00:07:08,666 --> 00:07:12,932 I want to first say that it is a blessing for me 131 00:07:12,933 --> 00:07:17,933 to be here with the precious students in the 132 00:07:17,933 --> 00:07:21,966 Ventura County network. I'm talking about Oxnard 133 00:07:21,966 --> 00:07:25,032 College, I'm talking about Ventura College, I'm 134 00:07:25,033 --> 00:07:30,766 talking about Moorpark as well. Sister Trinity, I 135 00:07:30,766 --> 00:07:32,732 want to thank you so very much, I look forward to 136 00:07:32,733 --> 00:07:35,166 our conversations, and of course, I want to salute 137 00:07:35,700 --> 00:07:38,333 a distinguished Professor Coleman. I want to 138 00:07:38,333 --> 00:07:41,566 salute the captain of the ship, my dear brother, 139 00:07:41,566 --> 00:07:45,532 President Sokenu. I want to salute my dear sister, who's 140 00:07:45,533 --> 00:07:48,366 the captain of another ship, I'm talking about 141 00:07:48,366 --> 00:07:50,966 President Hoffmans. And we want to thank brother 142 00:07:50,966 --> 00:07:54,099 Chancellor for his wonderful role in facilitating 143 00:07:54,566 --> 00:07:59,566 and keeping institutions afloat. And most 144 00:07:59,566 --> 00:08:02,199 importantly, I want to thank the Black Student 145 00:08:02,433 --> 00:08:06,966 Union for being kind enough to bring me so that I 146 00:08:06,966 --> 00:08:10,132 could attempt to say something, to be a force for 147 00:08:10,133 --> 00:08:14,699 good, to try to critically challenge our precious 148 00:08:14,700 --> 00:08:18,733 students. Now, I want to begin, with my own 149 00:08:18,933 --> 00:08:23,499 situation as a person, as a human being. At any 150 00:08:23,500 --> 00:08:26,033 time I think of human history, any time I think of 151 00:08:26,033 --> 00:08:28,566 American history, any time I think of modern 152 00:08:28,566 --> 00:08:30,966 history, any time I think of Black history, it 153 00:08:30,966 --> 00:08:35,866 goes back to acknowledging who we are as the 154 00:08:35,866 --> 00:08:40,199 persons that we are. So I begin with the notion, 155 00:08:40,366 --> 00:08:42,466 well it's more than a notion, again with the 156 00:08:42,466 --> 00:08:48,099 reality, I am who I am because somebody loved me. 157 00:08:49,266 --> 00:08:54,999 Somebody cared for me. Somebody tended to me, and 158 00:08:55,000 --> 00:09:00,733 so I situate myself in a very rich tradition of 159 00:09:00,733 --> 00:09:04,066 those who have been willing to attempt to 160 00:09:04,066 --> 00:09:08,432 cultivate the best inside of me. And this is very 161 00:09:08,433 --> 00:09:10,399 important because anytime you talk about race, you 162 00:09:10,400 --> 00:09:12,366 don't begin with name calling and finger pointing. 163 00:09:12,833 --> 00:09:15,799 You begin with trying to understand what has gone into 164 00:09:15,800 --> 00:09:19,233 the shaping and molding of who we are so that we 165 00:09:19,233 --> 00:09:25,666 can accept the best of who we are. Now I was blessed, 166 00:09:26,766 --> 00:09:29,832 to have the best father in the world, Clifton 167 00:09:29,833 --> 00:09:33,333 West, I'll never be the human being he was and I 168 00:09:33,333 --> 00:09:36,066 still have the best mother in the world, Irene B. West. There's still an 169 00:09:36,066 --> 00:09:38,532 elementary school named after her, Irene B. West 170 00:09:38,533 --> 00:09:41,666 Elementary School, right outside of Sacramento, 171 00:09:41,666 --> 00:09:45,566 California. And that magnificent West family is 172 00:09:45,566 --> 00:09:48,932 intertwined with Shiloh Baptist Church that's on 173 00:09:48,933 --> 00:09:53,166 the chocolate side of Sacramento, California. And 174 00:09:54,000 --> 00:09:58,966 I cannot even begin to understand my attempt to 175 00:09:58,966 --> 00:10:01,266 engage in truth telling and witness bearing and 176 00:10:01,266 --> 00:10:04,566 justice seeking without Irene and Clifton. 177 00:10:05,000 --> 00:10:08,133 Without Clifton, my blood brothers, Cynthia, Cheryl, 178 00:10:08,133 --> 00:10:10,566 without Willie P. Cooke, without Deacon Hinton, without 179 00:10:10,566 --> 00:10:14,032 Sarah Ray. We were told over and over again, "If 180 00:10:14,033 --> 00:10:16,799 the Kingdom of God is within you, then everywhere 181 00:10:16,800 --> 00:10:19,633 you go, you ought to leave a little Heaven behind." 182 00:10:19,900 --> 00:10:22,166 Now I know there's a whole lot of heaven being 183 00:10:22,400 --> 00:10:26,666 left behind there in Ventura County, especially 184 00:10:26,666 --> 00:10:29,732 with the students. But intellectually, that means 185 00:10:29,733 --> 00:10:33,599 what? Learning to think for yourself, to cultivate 186 00:10:33,600 --> 00:10:37,900 a critical consciousness, and then to allow for an 187 00:10:37,900 --> 00:10:42,166 unleashing of a loving soul so that you can leave 188 00:10:42,166 --> 00:10:45,332 heaven behind, by the thoughts you think, by the 189 00:10:45,333 --> 00:10:48,899 deeds you perform, by the community you're a part 190 00:10:48,900 --> 00:10:51,966 of. Now, why is this very important to talking 191 00:10:51,966 --> 00:10:55,166 about race and talking about Black history? Well, 192 00:10:55,166 --> 00:10:59,066 you all know. We live in one of the most polarized 193 00:10:59,066 --> 00:11:02,666 moments in the history of the country. It's so 194 00:11:02,666 --> 00:11:07,166 difficult to stay in contact with, let alone revel 195 00:11:07,433 --> 00:11:12,499 in the humanity of other people. Be it racial 196 00:11:12,500 --> 00:11:16,233 lines, religious lines, sexual orientational 197 00:11:16,233 --> 00:11:20,066 lines, gender lines, and the best of the tradition 198 00:11:20,066 --> 00:11:23,666 that has gone into me is always said, "Yes, we 199 00:11:23,666 --> 00:11:27,966 acknowledge our roots, R-O-O-T-S, we acknowledge our 200 00:11:27,966 --> 00:11:31,466 identity, our Black identity, brown identity, 201 00:11:31,466 --> 00:11:34,699 whatever identity it is, but all of those roots 202 00:11:34,700 --> 00:11:38,733 and those identities must be grounded in a moral 203 00:11:38,733 --> 00:11:43,533 and spiritual integrity, that allows us to embrace 204 00:11:43,533 --> 00:11:47,766 others with a global solidarity. And so when you 205 00:11:47,766 --> 00:11:49,932 talk about Black history and I talk about some 206 00:11:49,933 --> 00:11:52,966 ghettoized corner in the history of 207 00:11:52,966 --> 00:11:57,032 the nation, it's taking you right to the center of 208 00:11:57,033 --> 00:12:01,366 any serious and substantive quest for truth and 209 00:12:01,366 --> 00:12:06,666 justice. Justice is what love looks like in 210 00:12:06,966 --> 00:12:12,432 public, just like tenderness is what love feels 211 00:12:12,433 --> 00:12:18,166 like in private. In every institution of higher 212 00:12:18,166 --> 00:12:24,199 learning, purports to be involved in a pursuit, 213 00:12:24,200 --> 00:12:32,033 a quest for truth, for justice, for fairness, and 214 00:12:32,033 --> 00:12:35,833 there's no way in which you can talk about truth 215 00:12:35,833 --> 00:12:40,399 and justice and fairness without each one of us 216 00:12:40,400 --> 00:12:44,433 engaging in a Socratic self-examination. "The 217 00:12:44,433 --> 00:12:49,533 unexamined life is not worth living." That's Plato, that's 218 00:12:49,533 --> 00:12:53,699 line thirty three A in The Apology, but also a 219 00:12:53,700 --> 00:12:58,566 connection of our critical thinking with the 220 00:12:58,566 --> 00:13:04,166 suffering of others. Now we began this afternoon with 221 00:13:04,166 --> 00:13:10,032 John Coltrane. John Coltrane is a great wave in an 222 00:13:10,033 --> 00:13:15,266 ocean of people and of a tradition, my tradition 223 00:13:16,100 --> 00:13:20,766 of Black people, who for 400 years were 224 00:13:20,766 --> 00:13:25,232 chronically systemically hated, and yet keep 225 00:13:25,500 --> 00:13:30,533 dishing out love, what, is like John Coltrane, like 226 00:13:30,533 --> 00:13:34,566 Martin Luther King Junior, like Fannie Lou Hamer, 227 00:13:34,966 --> 00:13:39,932 like Ella Baker, like Harriet Tubman. I could go 228 00:13:39,933 --> 00:13:43,866 on and on and on, Stevie Wonder, love and the need 229 00:13:43,866 --> 00:13:48,566 to love, James Ball, love forces us to take off 230 00:13:48,566 --> 00:13:52,199 the mask we know we could not live with then, but 231 00:13:52,200 --> 00:13:58,166 fear we cannot live without. Same people being 232 00:13:58,166 --> 00:14:02,399 terrorized for 400 years, going all the way back 233 00:14:02,400 --> 00:14:06,200 when that first slave was put on that barbaric 234 00:14:06,200 --> 00:14:10,533 ship on the way to the new world. Our dear brother 235 00:14:10,533 --> 00:14:16,733 mentioned, brother Floyd, George Floyd, Jr., public 236 00:14:16,733 --> 00:14:20,533 lynching, another act of terrorism, but in the 237 00:14:20,533 --> 00:14:23,966 face of that terrorism, did the Black folk choose to 238 00:14:23,966 --> 00:14:26,132 terrorize others, the Black folk choose to create 239 00:14:26,133 --> 00:14:29,666 a black version of Ku Klux Klan? No, 240 00:14:29,866 --> 00:14:33,266 Frederick Douglass said, "You terrorize us. We want 241 00:14:33,266 --> 00:14:38,732 freedom for everybody." That's what it is to be a 242 00:14:38,866 --> 00:14:44,999 freedom fighter tied to being a love warrior. That's what 243 00:14:45,000 --> 00:14:47,766 Sojourner Truth said. That's what A. Philip 244 00:14:47,766 --> 00:14:52,099 Randolph said. That's what Donny Hathaway sang 245 00:14:52,100 --> 00:14:57,066 about. That's what Aretha sang about. Love warrior, 246 00:14:57,833 --> 00:15:01,766 freedom fighter. Same people, same tradition, 247 00:15:02,100 --> 00:15:07,233 traumatized for four hundred years. In the face of 248 00:15:07,233 --> 00:15:11,699 trauma, what, at our best choosing to be wounded 249 00:15:11,700 --> 00:15:17,166 healers, not wounded hurters. The wounded hurter 250 00:15:17,166 --> 00:15:19,932 is the worst of our tradition, the worst 251 00:15:19,933 --> 00:15:23,466 of any tradition. We come to elevate the best. 252 00:15:25,333 --> 00:15:30,999 Something is happening in Ventura County. And 253 00:15:31,000 --> 00:15:34,766 that's something that's happening at its best, has 254 00:15:34,766 --> 00:15:37,999 to do with human beings of all colors, human 255 00:15:38,000 --> 00:15:42,333 beings of all genders, of all sexual orientations, 256 00:15:42,333 --> 00:15:48,466 human beings choosing truth, justice, integrity, 257 00:15:48,833 --> 00:15:55,866 honesty, decency. And here in February, we say, "Ah 258 00:15:55,966 --> 00:16:00,566 let us keep track of our people who generated 259 00:16:00,566 --> 00:16:03,232 these love warriors and freedom fighters and 260 00:16:03,433 --> 00:16:08,599 wounded healers." So we can not just learn something 261 00:16:08,600 --> 00:16:12,766 from them, but we can inculcate their vision and 262 00:16:12,766 --> 00:16:17,866 their courage inside of us, so that we can be 263 00:16:18,033 --> 00:16:20,533 better love warriors, freedom fighters, and 264 00:16:20,533 --> 00:16:24,966 wounded healers. What a challenge and a moment in 265 00:16:24,966 --> 00:16:29,132 which our country is wrestling with such spiritual 266 00:16:29,133 --> 00:16:35,866 decay, hatred, contempt, arrogance, hostility, 267 00:16:36,133 --> 00:16:39,533 wrestling with such moral decrepitude, while 268 00:16:39,533 --> 00:16:43,166 people morn more. Push aside the Ten 269 00:16:43,166 --> 00:16:45,332 Commandments concerned with the 11th commandment, 270 00:16:45,333 --> 00:16:47,566 "Thou shalt not get caught. I'll do anything in 271 00:16:47,566 --> 00:16:49,832 order to be successful. I'll say anything and get 272 00:16:49,833 --> 00:16:53,733 away with it. I don't do anything with impunity." 273 00:16:54,800 --> 00:16:57,400 That's not just polarization, that's gangster- 274 00:16:57,400 --> 00:17:02,200 ization. And we're living at a time where gangster- 275 00:17:02,200 --> 00:17:05,133 rised ways of being in the world becoming more 276 00:17:05,133 --> 00:17:09,133 pervasive. Where commodification of everybody is for 277 00:17:09,133 --> 00:17:12,633 self, everything's for self. All we want is just 278 00:17:12,633 --> 00:17:18,799 money, status, celebrity, position. How empty 279 00:17:19,133 --> 00:17:23,599 life, of the love warriors, and freedom fighters, 280 00:17:24,300 --> 00:17:28,600 and wounded healers that constitute the best of 281 00:17:28,600 --> 00:17:32,866 the black tradition in the midst of the United 282 00:17:32,866 --> 00:17:38,232 States, that began with its settler colonial 283 00:17:38,233 --> 00:17:42,799 project, this will be the land of our precious Indigenous 284 00:17:42,800 --> 00:17:48,233 brothers and sisters. To the enslaved Africans could 285 00:17:48,233 --> 00:17:52,933 engage in phony wars against our precious Mexican 286 00:17:52,933 --> 00:17:56,199 brothers and sisters, so that California, wants 287 00:17:56,200 --> 00:18:01,633 Mexico, Texas, wants Mexico taken away by force. 288 00:18:02,133 --> 00:18:07,333 That is the worst of America. There is a best of 289 00:18:07,333 --> 00:18:13,866 America. Of all colors. All genders. All sexual 290 00:18:13,866 --> 00:18:17,866 orientations in this country. The people who 291 00:18:17,866 --> 00:18:22,066 out of love, and freedom, and a willingness to heal, 292 00:18:22,466 --> 00:18:25,166 said, "We're going to try to keep alive a fragile 293 00:18:25,166 --> 00:18:31,799 experiment in democracy that heeds the anthem of 294 00:18:31,800 --> 00:18:35,800 Black people, which is lift every voice." That 295 00:18:35,800 --> 00:18:39,233 means the voices on the reservation, take seriously 296 00:18:39,233 --> 00:18:41,899 the stories and visions, the voices in the hood, 297 00:18:42,000 --> 00:18:44,600 the voices in the barrio, the voices on the poor 298 00:18:44,600 --> 00:18:49,133 side of, the poor sections of the vanilla side 299 00:18:49,133 --> 00:18:52,933 of town. It's a human affair. Any time you talk 300 00:18:52,933 --> 00:18:57,299 about the best of Black history or the best of any 301 00:18:57,300 --> 00:19:00,200 history, I would argue. So let me stop there, I 302 00:19:00,200 --> 00:19:04,433 know sister Trinity, I think sister Trinity, 303 00:19:04,433 --> 00:19:07,999 and our sister Pauline is going to come and we'll 304 00:19:08,000 --> 00:19:11,266 have dialogue. And we won't worry about the time. 305 00:19:11,266 --> 00:19:13,432 We won't worry about the time at all I'll go with the 306 00:19:13,433 --> 00:19:14,099 spirit here. 307 00:19:19,933 --> 00:19:24,499 And my dear brother, Gerald. Looking so sharp with 308 00:19:24,500 --> 00:19:26,100 that beautiful smile you got. 309 00:19:38,266 --> 00:19:41,532 Gerald Richardson III: So with that, we will now enter our Q&A section, our 310 00:19:41,533 --> 00:19:45,366 this moderated section. I'll pass it on to 311 00:19:45,366 --> 00:19:46,166 Pauline. 312 00:19:46,166 --> 00:19:49,832 Pauline Nassar: Thank you, Gerald, and thank you, Dr. 313 00:19:49,833 --> 00:19:53,633 Cornel West. I just want to acknowledge Gerald 314 00:19:53,633 --> 00:19:56,733 Richardson and I one more time for not 315 00:19:56,733 --> 00:19:59,033 only organizing this event, but coming up with the 316 00:19:59,033 --> 00:20:02,066 questions for this event. With that being said, 317 00:20:02,066 --> 00:20:05,532 the first question is, you've written a lot about 318 00:20:05,533 --> 00:20:08,933 what it means to be an intellectual, especially a 319 00:20:08,933 --> 00:20:12,833 Black intellectual, but there's so much anti expert 320 00:20:13,133 --> 00:20:16,966 anti intellectual sentiment in the US. So what 321 00:20:16,966 --> 00:20:19,732 role do you see for intellectuals now in 322 00:20:19,733 --> 00:20:23,533 responding to the pandemic and the protests? 323 00:20:23,533 --> 00:20:23,899 Dr. Cornel West: What 324 00:20:23,900 --> 00:20:26,833 a wonderful question. And again, I salute both of 325 00:20:26,833 --> 00:20:29,133 you. And I talk about something's happening in 326 00:20:29,133 --> 00:20:32,466 Ventura County. I could just use both of you all 327 00:20:32,466 --> 00:20:37,232 as exhibition A. Because you're brilliant and 328 00:20:37,833 --> 00:20:42,366 sensitive and courageous young folk who's trying 329 00:20:42,366 --> 00:20:46,199 to make a difference. The issue of what it means 330 00:20:46,200 --> 00:20:48,700 to be an intellectual is a crucial one. I would 331 00:20:48,700 --> 00:20:51,133 want to recommend the book by the great Richard 332 00:20:51,133 --> 00:20:54,933 Hofstadter called Anti Intellectualism in America. 333 00:20:54,933 --> 00:20:58,099 It was published in 1963. Why is that important? 334 00:20:58,633 --> 00:21:02,799 Because he understood that America has always been 335 00:21:02,800 --> 00:21:05,933 profoundly anti intellectual. He understood 336 00:21:05,933 --> 00:21:08,566 there's a sense in which the business of America's 337 00:21:08,566 --> 00:21:12,432 business has been very much about making money. 338 00:21:12,866 --> 00:21:16,632 The vocation of being an intellectual is always 339 00:21:16,633 --> 00:21:20,566 over against simply making money. Everybody's got 340 00:21:20,566 --> 00:21:22,666 to make money. Everybody's got to have some cash 341 00:21:22,666 --> 00:21:25,499 flow. But to be an intellectual is to have a 342 00:21:25,500 --> 00:21:30,033 certain calling, certain vocation. And that 343 00:21:30,033 --> 00:21:34,633 vocation is to invest oneself in the life of the 344 00:21:34,633 --> 00:21:37,699 mind and the world of ideas so that you try to 345 00:21:37,933 --> 00:21:40,633 get people to think critically about themselves, 346 00:21:40,633 --> 00:21:44,166 about society, about the world. And he draws a 347 00:21:44,166 --> 00:21:46,132 very important distinction between intellect and 348 00:21:46,133 --> 00:21:49,833 intelligence, because America's always been very 349 00:21:49,833 --> 00:21:51,999 much for intelligence when it's tied to making 350 00:21:52,000 --> 00:21:56,666 money. We can go from Thomas Edison to Jeff Bezos. 351 00:21:57,366 --> 00:21:59,799 These a highly intelligent folk tied to making money. 352 00:22:01,133 --> 00:22:03,733 And as I say, you know, there's nothing wrong with 353 00:22:03,733 --> 00:22:06,666 making money as long as it doesn't become a fetish 354 00:22:06,666 --> 00:22:09,566 or an idol. As long as it doesn't generate an 355 00:22:09,566 --> 00:22:12,532 indifference inside of you toward the suffering of 356 00:22:12,533 --> 00:22:17,833 others. But the intellectual is he or she who is 357 00:22:17,833 --> 00:22:21,666 willing to pay any cost and bear any burden to 358 00:22:21,666 --> 00:22:26,632 raise the issues of truth. So, like Socrates, he's 359 00:22:26,633 --> 00:22:28,333 raising the issues of truth. What happened to 360 00:22:28,333 --> 00:22:32,866 Socrates? Oh, my God, he got the hemlock. Oh, 361 00:22:32,866 --> 00:22:35,466 Jesus, raising the issues of truth makes his way 362 00:22:35,466 --> 00:22:38,999 to the temple, runs out the money changers on his 363 00:22:39,000 --> 00:22:42,633 way to the cross. Oh, my God, he got. You got a 364 00:22:42,933 --> 00:22:47,233 serious price to pay. So that there's always a 365 00:22:47,233 --> 00:22:52,133 tension between the calling of vocation, of the 366 00:22:52,133 --> 00:22:55,366 truth seeking intellectual, as opposed to the 367 00:22:55,366 --> 00:23:00,966 money seeking business man or woman who is very 368 00:23:00,966 --> 00:23:05,132 suspicious of intellectuals. Another way of 369 00:23:05,133 --> 00:23:08,333 putting it is intelligence puts forward immediate 370 00:23:08,333 --> 00:23:14,633 evaluations. Intellect evaluates the evaluations. 371 00:23:15,466 --> 00:23:18,732 It looks at the deeper assumptions, the deeper 372 00:23:18,733 --> 00:23:22,666 presuppositions, and in that way there's always an 373 00:23:22,666 --> 00:23:25,599 end, but not up. James Baldwin talked about the 374 00:23:25,833 --> 00:23:29,866 lover's quarrel that intellectuals have with their 375 00:23:29,866 --> 00:23:33,899 own country. Because they're willing to be 376 00:23:33,900 --> 00:23:36,633 critical, to try to make it better. Does that begin 377 00:23:36,633 --> 00:23:39,099 to get at what you are after, my dear sister Pauline? 378 00:23:41,366 --> 00:23:45,132 Pauline: Definitely. Gerald, I will pass it on to you for 379 00:23:45,133 --> 00:23:46,666 the second question. 380 00:23:46,666 --> 00:23:48,366 Dr. West: Brother Gerald, who is that 381 00:23:48,366 --> 00:23:50,566 wonderful couple, you got behind you there man? 382 00:23:51,333 --> 00:23:54,066 Gerald: Those are my parents. Old photo. 383 00:23:54,066 --> 00:23:55,232 Dr. West: Ooh, what's their name, man? 384 00:23:56,000 --> 00:23:58,666 Gerald: Gerald Richardson the Second, and Marcia Richardson. 385 00:23:59,800 --> 00:24:02,233 Dr. West: Gerald and Marcia that makes you the third? 386 00:24:02,633 --> 00:24:03,199 Gerald: Yes. 387 00:24:04,133 --> 00:24:04,566 Dr. West: Oh, we need 388 00:24:04,566 --> 00:24:06,632 to put that. Oh you got the third on there. Yeah, 389 00:24:06,633 --> 00:24:08,833 you've got third. You showed. I didn't see that third. No, 390 00:24:09,500 --> 00:24:11,900 I kept looking at that beautiful picture because 391 00:24:11,900 --> 00:24:13,900 that's part of all their love that's going into the 392 00:24:13,900 --> 00:24:15,766 making and shaping of who you are. You know what I 393 00:24:15,766 --> 00:24:18,732 mean? I got her beautiful picture somewhere. I 394 00:24:18,733 --> 00:24:22,066 just can't see them. But we can see your beautiful 395 00:24:22,066 --> 00:24:24,332 parents. Go right ahead. 396 00:24:24,333 --> 00:24:26,399 Gerald: So I'm curious on your 397 00:24:26,400 --> 00:24:28,833 thoughts on color blindness. It's pervasive in 398 00:24:28,833 --> 00:24:32,233 education in particular, and we see this idea of 399 00:24:32,233 --> 00:24:35,633 professors and people in general having this idea 400 00:24:35,633 --> 00:24:38,166 that, "I don't see color," or that color does not 401 00:24:38,166 --> 00:24:40,999 matter. What are your thoughts on that? 402 00:24:41,000 --> 00:24:41,633 Dr. West: Yeah, you 403 00:24:41,633 --> 00:24:43,433 know, I just don't believe it. I don't believe it. 404 00:24:43,433 --> 00:24:46,599 I think that it's, people who say they don't 405 00:24:46,600 --> 00:24:50,166 see colors they mean something than what I think 406 00:24:50,166 --> 00:24:52,199 you and I are talking about. And I think to grow 407 00:24:52,200 --> 00:24:56,266 up in America, it's impossible for people to deny 408 00:24:56,766 --> 00:24:59,432 that color doesn't operate, race doesn't operate, 409 00:24:59,433 --> 00:25:02,033 and when one sees somebody just act as if they have 410 00:25:02,033 --> 00:25:06,099 no color whatsoever. I think what they 411 00:25:06,100 --> 00:25:09,833 really mean is for so long to see Black people of 412 00:25:09,833 --> 00:25:12,466 meant to associate us with a certain kind of 413 00:25:12,466 --> 00:25:16,966 inferiority and in people who say I'm colorblind, 414 00:25:16,966 --> 00:25:20,299 what you're saying is, "Well, I don't associate you 415 00:25:20,300 --> 00:25:22,433 with inferiority, but I still see your blackness. 416 00:25:23,233 --> 00:25:25,466 Because somebody looks at me and say they don't 417 00:25:25,466 --> 00:25:28,732 see my blackness at all. I said, "What are you 418 00:25:28,733 --> 00:25:32,233 looking at? Some Platonic form of Aristotelian 419 00:25:32,233 --> 00:25:35,933 essence. I got a body, you know, and my hair is a 420 00:25:35,933 --> 00:25:38,799 certain kind of shape." But you can acknowledge it. 421 00:25:38,900 --> 00:25:41,333 You know, you see my blackness, but my blackness 422 00:25:41,333 --> 00:25:44,366 is all I can tell you what humanity you see. But 423 00:25:44,366 --> 00:25:46,999 for me is that I think that we have to reject 424 00:25:47,000 --> 00:25:49,900 being colorblind and we have to affirm being 425 00:25:49,900 --> 00:25:53,333 lovestruck. You see, I'm a Christian, you see, 426 00:25:53,333 --> 00:25:56,599 so when you see folk, you ought to be able to 427 00:25:56,766 --> 00:25:59,466 affirm, approve, and even fall in love with the 428 00:25:59,466 --> 00:26:02,432 best of them. Fall in love, not in an intimate way, 429 00:26:02,733 --> 00:26:04,966 but a love with the fact that they're human beings. 430 00:26:04,966 --> 00:26:06,899 They have a preciousness, they have a dignity, 431 00:26:06,900 --> 00:26:09,933 they have a sanctity. And so that connects you 432 00:26:09,933 --> 00:26:13,533 with them. And so if we're lovestruck, rather than 433 00:26:13,533 --> 00:26:15,933 colorblind, then we don't have to lie to ourselves 434 00:26:15,933 --> 00:26:21,199 and say, "I'll never see color whatsoever." I don't 435 00:26:21,200 --> 00:26:24,166 know about that. Then you wanna ask, "Well, you got a 436 00:26:24,166 --> 00:26:26,766 son? You got a daughter? Oh, yes, I do. You didn't 437 00:26:26,766 --> 00:26:30,099 notice what color Jamal was when he came home with 438 00:26:30,100 --> 00:26:33,033 your daughter. Are you really saying that? I didn't notice 439 00:26:33,033 --> 00:26:37,933 what color Jamal, was at all?" Okay. Okay. Hard to 440 00:26:37,933 --> 00:26:42,533 believe. Hard to believe. So that we had to be able 441 00:26:42,533 --> 00:26:46,333 to revel in each other's humanity without claiming 442 00:26:46,333 --> 00:26:49,733 that somehow we're not seeing color. Because 443 00:26:49,866 --> 00:26:53,732 people's humanity comes in different colors. It comes 444 00:26:53,733 --> 00:26:57,266 in different languages. It comes in different genders, 445 00:26:57,266 --> 00:26:59,832 different sexual orientations, and so forth. So 446 00:26:59,833 --> 00:27:01,533 there's nothing wrong with embracing our 447 00:27:01,533 --> 00:27:04,999 particularity, in this case color and still being 448 00:27:05,000 --> 00:27:07,866 tied to universality, which is to say our humanity. 449 00:27:09,866 --> 00:27:11,732 Is that beginning to get at it? 450 00:27:11,733 --> 00:27:12,933 Gerald: More than, you know, 451 00:27:12,933 --> 00:27:15,633 that was amazing. Thank you. 452 00:27:15,633 --> 00:27:16,399 Dr. West: Thank you. 453 00:27:18,133 --> 00:27:21,266 Pauline: Thank you Gerald for asking this question. That is 454 00:27:21,266 --> 00:27:24,466 definitely something that needs to be shed light 455 00:27:24,466 --> 00:27:29,332 on. So thank you for that. Dr. West, what are your 456 00:27:29,333 --> 00:27:33,733 thoughts, sorry. As a professor, what do you see as the 457 00:27:33,733 --> 00:27:36,999 strength of this generation and things that you 458 00:27:37,000 --> 00:27:38,600 give pause to? 459 00:27:39,633 --> 00:27:41,466 Dr. West: Ooh, wonderful question. I 460 00:27:41,466 --> 00:27:44,432 appreciate this conversation with you all. You know, 461 00:27:44,433 --> 00:27:49,033 it's hard for me to fully grasp the richness of 462 00:27:49,033 --> 00:27:51,733 the younger generation. I'm old school, you know, 463 00:27:51,733 --> 00:27:55,833 I'm OG from way back. I'll be almost 70 years old 464 00:27:55,833 --> 00:27:59,599 pretty soon and I spend a lot of time with young 465 00:27:59,600 --> 00:28:02,833 people. I insist on teaching freshmen just to be 466 00:28:02,833 --> 00:28:05,699 able to stay in contact with young people. But 467 00:28:05,700 --> 00:28:08,833 young people are growing up in the most 468 00:28:08,833 --> 00:28:11,433 commodified culture in the history of the world, 469 00:28:11,633 --> 00:28:14,833 the most market driven, market saturated culture 470 00:28:14,833 --> 00:28:17,633 in the history of the world. And what are markets 471 00:28:17,633 --> 00:28:20,233 about? Markets are about money. They're about profit. 472 00:28:20,233 --> 00:28:23,399 They're about manipulation. They're about us 473 00:28:23,400 --> 00:28:29,200 titillation and stimulation. Whereas, what young 474 00:28:29,200 --> 00:28:31,900 people are hungry for, is 475 00:28:35,266 --> 00:28:40,266 that which nourishes them, hearts, minds, and souls. 476 00:28:41,433 --> 00:28:45,033 Yes, they want to make money. Yes, they want 477 00:28:45,033 --> 00:28:51,266 status, but in the end, they also want care. They 478 00:28:51,266 --> 00:28:56,199 also want concern. They also want love. They want 479 00:28:56,200 --> 00:29:01,400 justice. Those are non-market values. Fidelity. They 480 00:29:01,400 --> 00:29:04,966 want trust. Another way of putting it is that I 481 00:29:04,966 --> 00:29:08,966 discovered that the younger generation, they are 482 00:29:09,066 --> 00:29:13,566 hungry for the real thing. They tired of fakes 483 00:29:13,566 --> 00:29:17,832 and phonies. They tired of frauds. They tired 484 00:29:17,833 --> 00:29:21,366 of people posing and posturing one way and 485 00:29:21,366 --> 00:29:25,166 actually really being something else. See, I would 486 00:29:25,166 --> 00:29:27,832 highly recommend that young people listen to some 487 00:29:27,833 --> 00:29:31,866 Ashford and Simpson. Nicholas Ashford, Valerie 488 00:29:31,866 --> 00:29:36,599 Simpson had that song, "Ain't Nothing Like The Real 489 00:29:36,800 --> 00:29:41,633 Thing." And what is the real thing, the real thing 490 00:29:41,866 --> 00:29:47,332 is beneath all the superficiality. He said, "You're 491 00:29:47,333 --> 00:29:50,433 not going to fake the funk." Now, young folk don't 492 00:29:50,433 --> 00:29:54,133 wanna fake the funk, they want the real thing and 493 00:29:54,133 --> 00:29:57,199 the real thing is the love, the friendship, the 494 00:29:57,333 --> 00:30:00,233 struggling with truth, the struggling with justice, 495 00:30:00,233 --> 00:30:02,833 the struggling with fairness, even when we're wrong.. 496 00:30:04,066 --> 00:30:07,866 All of us as human beings will be wrong, at some 497 00:30:07,866 --> 00:30:12,299 point. But you have to say what you mean, you got 498 00:30:12,300 --> 00:30:16,966 to mean what you say. That's the real thing. That 499 00:30:16,966 --> 00:30:18,799 to me is something that young folk are hungry for. 500 00:30:19,733 --> 00:30:23,833 Would you all agree or disagree with that? With 501 00:30:23,833 --> 00:30:25,499 that formulation? 502 00:30:25,500 --> 00:30:27,566 Gerald: Agree 100 percent. 503 00:30:27,566 --> 00:30:28,532 Dr. West: Does that make 504 00:30:28,533 --> 00:30:29,166 sense to both of you? 505 00:30:31,366 --> 00:30:33,232 Pauline: Definitely. 506 00:30:33,233 --> 00:30:36,199 Dr. West: That's good. That's good. 507 00:30:36,200 --> 00:30:36,800 That's good. 508 00:30:40,000 --> 00:30:43,300 Gerald: I'm curious, as a political philosopher, 509 00:30:43,300 --> 00:30:45,566 I'm curious your thoughts on this. As you know, we 510 00:30:45,566 --> 00:30:48,832 are in California and Proposition 16, which was 511 00:30:48,833 --> 00:30:51,033 affirmative action, it actually failed in 512 00:30:51,033 --> 00:30:55,199 California. The voters did not vote for it. So I'm 513 00:30:55,200 --> 00:30:57,666 wondering, what are your thoughts on affirmative 514 00:30:57,666 --> 00:31:00,932 action policies? Are they effective, or what do you 515 00:31:00,933 --> 00:31:03,166 think of race conscious policies that establish 516 00:31:03,166 --> 00:31:06,999 equity? What would be your ideal policy? 517 00:31:07,000 --> 00:31:07,833 Dr. West: Well, one 518 00:31:07,833 --> 00:31:09,899 is, you know, I've been fighting my dear brother, 519 00:31:09,900 --> 00:31:12,500 Ward Connerly and I from the same city of 520 00:31:12,500 --> 00:31:17,966 Sacramento. He's from Sacramento. And he and I 521 00:31:17,966 --> 00:31:20,332 have been clashing on this for a long, long, 522 00:31:20,333 --> 00:31:22,233 long time. I love my brother, you know, I'm a 523 00:31:22,233 --> 00:31:24,933 Christian, I try to love everybody, but at the same 524 00:31:24,933 --> 00:31:28,433 time, I've got some political foes and I can stay 525 00:31:28,433 --> 00:31:30,766 in contact with the humanity of my foes and still 526 00:31:30,766 --> 00:31:33,999 have deep disagreement. But there's no doubt that 527 00:31:34,000 --> 00:31:36,466 affirmative action is something that not only has 528 00:31:36,466 --> 00:31:38,632 played a fundamental role, I wouldn't even be 529 00:31:38,633 --> 00:31:40,999 where I am without affirmative action, because the 530 00:31:41,000 --> 00:31:44,166 racism and I would add sexism too, was cut so deep 531 00:31:45,366 --> 00:31:48,332 all the way up until the 1970s and 80s when it 532 00:31:48,333 --> 00:31:51,333 began, when affirmative action began to have some 533 00:31:51,333 --> 00:31:53,266 impact. Now, affirmative action, unfortunately, 534 00:31:53,266 --> 00:31:57,066 doesn't connect with our precious poor brothers and 535 00:31:57,066 --> 00:31:59,632 sisters. Doesn't affect many working class 536 00:31:59,633 --> 00:32:01,433 brothers and sisters. Much of a more middle class 537 00:32:01,433 --> 00:32:04,366 affair. For those who have educations. Only 31 538 00:32:04,366 --> 00:32:08,199 percent of folks in America who even go to college. So 539 00:32:08,200 --> 00:32:11,800 you got 68, 69 percent don't go at all. And so 540 00:32:11,800 --> 00:32:14,333 affirmative action, especially in higher education, 541 00:32:14,333 --> 00:32:17,099 has been confined to a certain group. But 542 00:32:17,100 --> 00:32:20,233 affirmative action is very important. Why? Because 543 00:32:20,233 --> 00:32:22,099 there's still institutional racism in the 544 00:32:22,100 --> 00:32:25,466 country. There's still individual racism in the 545 00:32:25,466 --> 00:32:29,632 country. And people have to be accountable when 546 00:32:29,633 --> 00:32:32,433 they're engaged in judgments based on those kinds 547 00:32:32,433 --> 00:32:35,799 of racist biases. And so all affirmative action 548 00:32:35,800 --> 00:32:38,733 was saying is we've got a certain pool of 549 00:32:38,733 --> 00:32:41,733 qualified people and for so long there's been Black 550 00:32:41,733 --> 00:32:44,333 people who are qualified but never given a chance. 551 00:32:45,766 --> 00:32:48,799 So once you meet those minimal qualifications, for 552 00:32:49,266 --> 00:32:53,499 faculty, staff, students, then everybody in 553 00:32:53,500 --> 00:32:56,733 that pool ought to be taken seriously and you 554 00:32:56,733 --> 00:33:00,433 ought to be conscious about the fact that two 555 00:33:00,433 --> 00:33:02,933 hundred and forty four years of racist slavery, 556 00:33:03,533 --> 00:33:06,199 almost one hundred years of racist neo slavery 557 00:33:06,200 --> 00:33:08,666 called Jim and Jane Crow, and those effects, the 558 00:33:08,666 --> 00:33:11,732 consequences are still at work, both in our 559 00:33:11,733 --> 00:33:14,366 structures as well as in our minds. So all 560 00:33:14,366 --> 00:33:16,499 affirmative action was saying is we have to be 561 00:33:16,500 --> 00:33:19,300 conscious of that. And the same would be true with 562 00:33:19,300 --> 00:33:24,100 women, given it ugly patriarchal practices that 563 00:33:24,100 --> 00:33:27,233 have been going on for so long. So in that sense, 564 00:33:27,233 --> 00:33:31,233 I think that it's sad that the state of 565 00:33:31,233 --> 00:33:34,466 California rejected that. There's a lot of 566 00:33:34,466 --> 00:33:36,566 misinformation out there. There's a lot of 567 00:33:36,566 --> 00:33:41,699 disinformation out there. And this is the 568 00:33:41,700 --> 00:33:44,100 second time California has done that. People think 569 00:33:44,100 --> 00:33:47,066 of California, it's so progressive, it's so liberal and so 570 00:33:47,066 --> 00:33:50,599 what you say. "Well, it depends on what the issue 571 00:33:50,600 --> 00:33:55,000 is." You see, "In Mississippi, well we understand," well 572 00:33:55,133 --> 00:33:57,533 Mississippi got some progressive folk, too, but 573 00:33:57,533 --> 00:33:59,933 not like California on certain issues. But when it 574 00:33:59,933 --> 00:34:03,733 comes to affirmative action voting, California, 575 00:34:04,400 --> 00:34:08,633 the other states, California, still behind, but I 576 00:34:08,633 --> 00:34:10,966 mean, it's a complex issue and you can imagine, you know, the 577 00:34:10,966 --> 00:34:13,432 debate, Ward and the others they got their 578 00:34:13,433 --> 00:34:15,699 reasons in terms of liberties. They've got their 579 00:34:15,700 --> 00:34:19,566 reasons in terms of low expectations, and that we 580 00:34:19,566 --> 00:34:23,099 never want to have low expectations of anybody, 581 00:34:23,100 --> 00:34:25,300 especially Black students, especially brown 582 00:34:25,300 --> 00:34:28,733 students. But at the same time, I think you have 583 00:34:28,733 --> 00:34:31,833 to make sure you have countervailing forces 584 00:34:31,833 --> 00:34:35,433 against the institutional and personal racism that 585 00:34:35,433 --> 00:34:38,866 is still very much operative, not just in Ventura 586 00:34:38,866 --> 00:34:43,266 County, it's operative at Harvard University, it's 587 00:34:43,266 --> 00:34:46,466 operated at Yale, it's operative at Princeton, it's 588 00:34:46,466 --> 00:34:49,366 operative at University of Chicago, is operative at 589 00:34:49,366 --> 00:34:52,832 University of New Mexico. It's across the country, it's 590 00:34:52,833 --> 00:34:57,399 not just California. It is a domestic national 591 00:34:57,400 --> 00:34:57,933 issue. 592 00:35:01,866 --> 00:35:05,132 Gerald: Thank you, brother West. Just a follow up question, 593 00:35:05,700 --> 00:35:08,266 do you think there are other effective race 594 00:35:08,266 --> 00:35:11,566 conscious policies that California could possibly 595 00:35:11,566 --> 00:35:12,499 introduce? 596 00:35:14,000 --> 00:35:16,166 Dr. West: That's a good question, no, I mean, 597 00:35:16,166 --> 00:35:22,399 I think there's ways of trying to gain access to 598 00:35:22,400 --> 00:35:26,800 highly talented Black and brown and Indigenous 599 00:35:26,900 --> 00:35:30,200 Asian brothers and sisters, but you have to be 600 00:35:30,200 --> 00:35:34,400 creative about it. You've got to be creative about 601 00:35:34,400 --> 00:35:37,233 it. So that, for example, we always have a group of 602 00:35:37,933 --> 00:35:40,199 of White brothers and sisters or vanilla of 603 00:35:40,200 --> 00:35:43,333 brothers and sisters who are committed to fairness, 604 00:35:43,833 --> 00:35:47,899 who are committed to justice. And there's ways in 605 00:35:47,900 --> 00:35:51,233 which through their networks, they can still bring 606 00:35:51,233 --> 00:35:54,033 in some high quality Black and brown and 607 00:35:54,033 --> 00:35:57,666 Indigenous peoples. You see it I mean, they just 608 00:35:57,666 --> 00:36:00,666 had to be courageous and how to go about doing it. 609 00:36:01,533 --> 00:36:04,799 You see, that's the key. That's the key. 610 00:36:08,200 --> 00:36:08,966 Gerald: Definitely. 611 00:36:09,766 --> 00:36:11,466 Dr. West: Indeed. Indeed. 612 00:36:13,233 --> 00:36:14,233 Pauline: We'll go on to the next 613 00:36:14,233 --> 00:36:18,433 question. Thank you, Dr. West. How has your view of 614 00:36:18,433 --> 00:36:21,066 civil rights changed over the years? How has the 615 00:36:21,066 --> 00:36:24,799 dialogue about critical social issues changed over 616 00:36:24,800 --> 00:36:25,633 the years? 617 00:36:25,633 --> 00:36:28,766 Dr. West: Ooh, that's a good one, now. Well, 618 00:36:28,766 --> 00:36:31,466 I was blessed, you know, to grow up in Sacramento, 619 00:36:31,466 --> 00:36:36,632 California, at a time in which Martin Luther King 620 00:36:36,633 --> 00:36:40,866 Jr. was still alive. I saw him speak at Memorial 621 00:36:40,866 --> 00:36:44,932 Auditorium, downtown Sacramento when he was shot 622 00:36:44,933 --> 00:36:49,499 down in Memphis, on the porch there at Lorraine Hotel 623 00:36:49,866 --> 00:36:53,066 I was in student body President, Kennedy High. We 624 00:36:53,066 --> 00:36:55,632 organized student body presidents throughout the city. 625 00:36:55,633 --> 00:36:58,333 We shut down the city with a student strike till 626 00:36:58,333 --> 00:37:01,699 they had black studies in those high schools, 627 00:37:01,866 --> 00:37:05,732 right? Now, at that time, civil rights had to do 628 00:37:05,733 --> 00:37:11,199 with not just voting, not just access to suburbs, 629 00:37:11,200 --> 00:37:15,566 that have been discriminating against Black people, 630 00:37:16,033 --> 00:37:21,133 but it also was spilling over, into what Malcolm X 631 00:37:21,133 --> 00:37:24,933 called human rights. And so we begin to talk about 632 00:37:24,933 --> 00:37:29,499 the right to food, the right to shelter, the right 633 00:37:29,500 --> 00:37:33,166 to a job with a living wage, and then the right to 634 00:37:33,166 --> 00:37:35,199 health care. That's why I spent so much time with 635 00:37:35,200 --> 00:37:38,200 my dear brother Bernie Sanders, right? He was saying 636 00:37:38,200 --> 00:37:42,100 health care is a right. It doesn't have to be mediated by 637 00:37:42,100 --> 00:37:44,000 the market in terms of what kind of job you have, 638 00:37:44,000 --> 00:37:46,000 if you lose your job, lose your health care and so 639 00:37:46,000 --> 00:37:49,033 forth. And millions and millions of Americans 640 00:37:49,033 --> 00:37:50,733 don't have health care in the richest nation in 641 00:37:50,733 --> 00:37:52,366 the history of the world. No, there ought to be a 642 00:37:52,366 --> 00:37:55,366 right to health care. It's like there's a right to 643 00:37:55,366 --> 00:37:59,432 water. You see, you got to de-commodify it, you 644 00:37:59,533 --> 00:38:02,433 know, it's not a matter of just having money, in 645 00:38:02,433 --> 00:38:04,599 order to have health care or having a job just to 646 00:38:04,600 --> 00:38:08,666 have health care. So in that sense, a human right 647 00:38:08,666 --> 00:38:14,466 is really the starting point for me, and it has 648 00:38:14,466 --> 00:38:17,166 been ever since I was 14 years old. I mean, it's 649 00:38:17,166 --> 00:38:20,399 very interesting how people still call me a civil 650 00:38:20,400 --> 00:38:24,166 rights activist because I've been a human rights 651 00:38:24,166 --> 00:38:26,532 activist all my life. I'm concerned about human 652 00:38:26,533 --> 00:38:29,633 rights of my brothers, sisters in Pakistan and 653 00:38:29,633 --> 00:38:34,133 Libya, in Somalia, vis a vis US drones. I'm 654 00:38:34,133 --> 00:38:36,399 concerned about the human rights of my Jewish 655 00:38:36,400 --> 00:38:38,566 brothers and sisters in Russia, my Palestinian 656 00:38:38,800 --> 00:38:41,800 brothers, sisters on the Israeli occupation. I'm 657 00:38:41,800 --> 00:38:44,233 concerned about human rights in Tibet and Kashmir 658 00:38:44,233 --> 00:38:47,166 and so forth. I try to be morally consistent. Gets you 659 00:38:47,266 --> 00:38:50,466 a lot of trouble. That's all right. Nothing's 660 00:38:50,466 --> 00:38:52,666 going to stand in the way of my love for oppressed 661 00:38:52,666 --> 00:38:56,532 people wherever they are in the world, no matter 662 00:38:56,533 --> 00:39:00,266 how unpopular it is. That's all right with me. I'm 663 00:39:00,266 --> 00:39:03,332 a Christian. I'm following an un pompous, a 664 00:39:03,333 --> 00:39:07,399 very unpopular Palestinian Jew named Jesus. And if he was 665 00:39:07,400 --> 00:39:10,033 around, he would say the Palestinians, the 666 00:39:10,166 --> 00:39:14,332 Israelis, the Ethiopians, the Russians, all of 667 00:39:14,333 --> 00:39:18,633 them have equal value. And when they are suffering, 668 00:39:18,833 --> 00:39:22,866 I'm going to raise my voice, no matter what. But 669 00:39:22,866 --> 00:39:24,966 it's got to have that moral and spiritual 670 00:39:24,966 --> 00:39:29,999 integrity to it, you see? And in that sense, I 671 00:39:30,000 --> 00:39:32,533 think it's interesting when I say, "Well, you're a 672 00:39:32,533 --> 00:39:34,933 civil rights act." But what they're really saying 673 00:39:35,733 --> 00:39:38,899 and that's a compliment, they're saying, "We know 674 00:39:38,900 --> 00:39:41,700 you, a Black man, everybody calls him a 675 00:39:41,700 --> 00:39:44,533 civil rights must be black." Well no you got a lot of 676 00:39:44,533 --> 00:39:46,633 White civil rights activists. They don't call them 677 00:39:46,633 --> 00:39:51,166 civil rights activists. They think about Martin King. 678 00:39:51,166 --> 00:39:53,666 That's a compliment for me, right, because Martin 679 00:39:53,666 --> 00:39:56,966 King is one of the great figures, but was Martin 680 00:39:56,966 --> 00:40:00,532 King, only a civil rights activist? No, he said a 681 00:40:00,533 --> 00:40:04,399 baby in Vietnam has the same value as a baby in 682 00:40:04,400 --> 00:40:09,233 America. That's beyond civil rights. He's talking 683 00:40:09,233 --> 00:40:14,699 about US imperial policy in Asia and he called it 684 00:40:14,700 --> 00:40:16,433 that, but they still called him a civil rights activist. 685 00:40:18,400 --> 00:40:20,900 Malcolm X civil rights activist, but no he said he was a 686 00:40:20,900 --> 00:40:24,066 human rights activist, right, coming out of a rich Muslim 687 00:40:24,066 --> 00:40:28,266 tradition with all of the prophetic possibilities 688 00:40:28,466 --> 00:40:32,532 of the Muslim tradition. Just like the Judaic 689 00:40:32,533 --> 00:40:35,599 tradition, prophetic possibilities out of Judaism. 690 00:40:35,733 --> 00:40:38,266 Just like my own Christian tradition, prophetic 691 00:40:38,266 --> 00:40:41,232 possibilities out of the Christian tradition. But 692 00:40:41,233 --> 00:40:46,133 each one of those traditions also had a whole lot 693 00:40:46,133 --> 00:40:50,966 of challenges. Judaism, Christianity, Islam, 694 00:40:50,966 --> 00:40:55,432 oftentimes they too patriarchal. Oftentimes, they 695 00:40:55,433 --> 00:40:59,666 are too homophobic. Oftentimes they're too tribal, 696 00:40:59,666 --> 00:41:02,166 they only concerned about just a small slice of 697 00:41:02,166 --> 00:41:04,732 humanity and not human beings across the board. 698 00:41:04,733 --> 00:41:06,566 You see what I mean? So each one of those 699 00:41:06,566 --> 00:41:09,066 traditions have struggles, has struggles within them. 700 00:41:10,466 --> 00:41:12,366 And that's the way it's always been, I think 701 00:41:12,366 --> 00:41:14,432 that's probably the way it will always be. 702 00:41:18,966 --> 00:41:20,632 Pauline: Thank you for that and thank you for bringing 703 00:41:20,633 --> 00:41:23,899 light. I got very excited when you started talking 704 00:41:23,900 --> 00:41:26,066 about the Israeli and Palestinian conflict, 705 00:41:26,066 --> 00:41:29,766 because I don't think a lot of people bring light 706 00:41:29,766 --> 00:41:33,732 to that issue. So I have a follow up question for 707 00:41:33,733 --> 00:41:37,099 that. How have your politics around global issues 708 00:41:37,100 --> 00:41:39,500 made you controversial? 709 00:41:39,500 --> 00:41:41,800 Dr. West: Oh, I've just controversial 710 00:41:41,800 --> 00:41:44,033 from the very beginning when we had that strike, 711 00:41:44,033 --> 00:41:47,599 when I was 14 years old, they said, "Brother 712 00:41:47,600 --> 00:41:49,433 you put on this strike you're never going to get 713 00:41:49,433 --> 00:41:52,333 into college because they're gonna keep track of you 714 00:41:52,333 --> 00:41:54,899 when you's applying to college, you'd already shut 715 00:41:54,900 --> 00:41:57,833 the city down with the student strike." I said, 716 00:41:57,833 --> 00:41:59,899 "Well, that's just going to have to be what it is," 717 00:42:00,833 --> 00:42:03,799 you see. Then we had struggles around Latin 718 00:42:03,800 --> 00:42:06,233 America in El Salvador. We had struggles around 719 00:42:06,233 --> 00:42:09,533 Honduras. When I went to New York City and I 720 00:42:09,533 --> 00:42:12,399 encountered one of the great public intellectuals of 721 00:42:12,400 --> 00:42:16,000 the 20th century named Edward Said. And he and I 722 00:42:16,000 --> 00:42:18,433 used to go down to The New York Times and said, 723 00:42:18,433 --> 00:42:20,599 you should use the word occupation rather than 724 00:42:20,600 --> 00:42:23,633 disputed territories. Occupation was in the making. 725 00:42:23,633 --> 00:42:26,499 This is way back in the 70s and the 80s, but it was 726 00:42:26,500 --> 00:42:30,100 based on the same kind of moral and spiritual 727 00:42:30,700 --> 00:42:33,100 willingness. And I think part of the problem, the 728 00:42:33,100 --> 00:42:36,733 reason why it is difficult to have a serious and 729 00:42:36,733 --> 00:42:42,899 respectful conversation about our precious Jewish 730 00:42:42,900 --> 00:42:44,866 Israeli brothers and sisters and precious 731 00:42:44,866 --> 00:42:47,099 Palestinian brothers and sisters, because it's 732 00:42:47,100 --> 00:42:50,700 been a taboo issue. People don't want to touch it. 733 00:42:51,266 --> 00:42:55,332 And you have to be able to confront taboo issues. 734 00:42:55,700 --> 00:42:57,300 So you got a lot of people who want to talk about 735 00:42:57,300 --> 00:42:59,233 every issue, but that issue. You say, "Well, 736 00:42:59,233 --> 00:43:01,233 wait, wait, wait a minute. Now we got to be 737 00:43:01,233 --> 00:43:04,033 consistent. You got to stay in contact with humanity of your 738 00:43:04,466 --> 00:43:06,232 Jewish brothers. You got to stay in contact with 739 00:43:06,233 --> 00:43:08,666 humanity of your Palestinian brothers, sisters." And I say 740 00:43:08,666 --> 00:43:11,332 over and over again, if there were a Palestinian 741 00:43:11,333 --> 00:43:13,733 occupation of precious Jewish brothers and sisters, 742 00:43:14,000 --> 00:43:17,633 there would be a major, major conversation in the 743 00:43:17,633 --> 00:43:22,299 country. [Pauline]: I agree. [Dr. West]: You see, and I would be just as upset I'd 744 00:43:22,300 --> 00:43:25,400 be with my Jewish, Palestinian brothers, "Quit 745 00:43:25,400 --> 00:43:27,800 occupying the Jewish brothers and sisters on moral 746 00:43:27,800 --> 00:43:30,700 spiritual ground." Now, it's the opposite. Now you 747 00:43:30,700 --> 00:43:33,366 got Israeli occupation. I'll say exactly the same 748 00:43:33,366 --> 00:43:35,999 thing. How come? Because I love both of them, both of 749 00:43:36,000 --> 00:43:38,266 them are human beings. And if both of them are 750 00:43:38,266 --> 00:43:40,499 dominating anybody that is called into question, 751 00:43:40,666 --> 00:43:43,066 just like me and Gerald, if we were part of a 752 00:43:43,066 --> 00:43:46,566 black supremacist country, if Black people had 753 00:43:46,566 --> 00:43:48,932 treated White people the way White people treated 754 00:43:48,933 --> 00:43:51,666 Black people, we would be in solidarity with the White 755 00:43:51,666 --> 00:43:55,766 brothers and sisters. We don't want to be associated 756 00:43:55,766 --> 00:43:58,066 with black dominators just because we black. 757 00:44:00,000 --> 00:44:04,133 Domination is wrong no matter who does it, right? 758 00:44:04,333 --> 00:44:06,299 But that's not the case. We don't live in a black 759 00:44:06,300 --> 00:44:09,033 supremacist civilization. We live in a 760 00:44:09,033 --> 00:44:12,166 civilization shaped by white supremacy. And so 761 00:44:12,166 --> 00:44:14,932 based on the same moral spiritual grounds, we're in 762 00:44:14,933 --> 00:44:17,733 solidarity with those folks. Of course, we got the 763 00:44:17,733 --> 00:44:19,966 history of black gangsters and black thugs 764 00:44:20,433 --> 00:44:22,599 everywhere because every community got gangsters 765 00:44:22,600 --> 00:44:25,000 and thugs. You got Jewish thugs, you got 766 00:44:25,000 --> 00:44:27,333 Palestinian thugs. And we got to be against 767 00:44:27,333 --> 00:44:31,666 thuggery, across the board. Right? Why? Because 768 00:44:31,666 --> 00:44:34,799 we're committed to what is right, what is moral, 769 00:44:34,800 --> 00:44:38,166 and what is just, and what is right and moral and 770 00:44:38,166 --> 00:44:42,766 just is never a function of just race, gender, 771 00:44:42,933 --> 00:44:47,133 sexual orientation, nation. Every identity must be 772 00:44:47,133 --> 00:44:50,599 grounded in a moral and spiritual integrity and a 773 00:44:50,600 --> 00:44:55,700 global solidarity. That's the key. But for so long 774 00:44:55,700 --> 00:44:57,866 in the United States, you know, Black folk 775 00:44:57,866 --> 00:45:00,732 remained invisible, just like Palestinians for so 776 00:45:00,733 --> 00:45:03,933 long had been rendered invisible. Their suffering 777 00:45:03,933 --> 00:45:07,233 invisible, black suffering, invisible. And we can 778 00:45:07,233 --> 00:45:09,199 see that of other groups as well. 779 00:45:16,100 --> 00:45:22,466 Pauline: Thank you for that. [Gerald]: Thank you. For sure. What are your 780 00:45:22,466 --> 00:45:26,099 thoughts about the recent insurrection? 781 00:45:26,100 --> 00:45:26,766 Dr. West: Oh, you 782 00:45:26,766 --> 00:45:31,599 mean the, someone of our sick, more thuggish White 783 00:45:31,600 --> 00:45:33,766 brothers and sisters who took over the Capitol the 784 00:45:33,766 --> 00:45:39,499 other day? [Gerald]: Yup. [Dr. West]: Well, one is that. You know, we 785 00:45:39,500 --> 00:45:43,400 have a long history of vigilante activity on 786 00:45:43,400 --> 00:45:47,466 behalf of, enacted by white supremacist militia 787 00:45:47,466 --> 00:45:52,632 groups. Many of us, you know, have our own names on their on 788 00:45:52,633 --> 00:45:54,733 the list in terms of who they want to hunt down. 789 00:45:56,600 --> 00:46:01,033 Now, the groups are about, what, about 900? I saw 790 00:46:01,033 --> 00:46:04,533 the same thing when I was in Charlottesville, 2017. 791 00:46:05,200 --> 00:46:07,766 We had the neo-nazis and the Klan, you know, 792 00:46:08,233 --> 00:46:11,699 spiritually sick White brothers, some sisters, 793 00:46:12,300 --> 00:46:16,666 some White sisters, mainly White brothers who were coming 794 00:46:16,666 --> 00:46:19,432 at us tooth and nail. What has happened on the 795 00:46:19,433 --> 00:46:22,199 Trump has become more they feel more 796 00:46:22,200 --> 00:46:25,866 emboldened. So it spills over now in the public. 797 00:46:25,866 --> 00:46:31,866 They've always been there. Always been there very much so, and 798 00:46:32,000 --> 00:46:34,600 part of the progress of the country is to try to 799 00:46:34,600 --> 00:46:38,600 cut back on the white supremacist sensibilities 800 00:46:38,600 --> 00:46:42,300 and mentalities in the country. And there has been 801 00:46:42,300 --> 00:46:45,233 some progress on that. You know, you go back 50, 802 00:46:45,233 --> 00:46:48,933 60 years ago, a lot of those same folk who stormed 803 00:46:48,933 --> 00:46:52,799 the Capitol, they were running states, 804 00:46:52,800 --> 00:46:55,633 They were governors. They were running 805 00:46:55,800 --> 00:46:59,333 committees in Congress. They were senators, you 806 00:46:59,433 --> 00:47:02,733 see. So there's been some attempt to push it back. 807 00:47:02,966 --> 00:47:05,266 But any time you attempt to push it back, what do 808 00:47:05,266 --> 00:47:07,332 you get? A backlash. 809 00:47:09,366 --> 00:47:13,332 And we've seen the backlash against any perceived 810 00:47:13,333 --> 00:47:15,633 progress on behalf of Black people and brown 811 00:47:15,633 --> 00:47:19,399 people and others, and since '65, we've had 812 00:47:19,400 --> 00:47:21,700 such a racist and white supremacist immigration 813 00:47:21,700 --> 00:47:26,333 policy that was enacted in 1924, pushed by deeply 814 00:47:26,333 --> 00:47:29,266 conservative folk, including the Klan at 1924 815 00:47:29,266 --> 00:47:31,466 to '65, it was mainly just 816 00:47:31,766 --> 00:47:35,099 White brothers and sisters from Europe who could get gain access. 817 00:47:35,766 --> 00:47:39,299 After '65 now, large numbers of brothers and sisters from 818 00:47:39,300 --> 00:47:42,633 Asia, Middle East, Africa start coming in the 819 00:47:42,633 --> 00:47:49,099 country. These beautiful folk from Nigeria, 820 00:47:49,466 --> 00:47:56,232 Ethiopia, Uganda, Pakistan, Afghanistan, Singapore, 821 00:47:57,133 --> 00:48:00,066 folks from the Middle East come marching in from Persia, 822 00:48:00,066 --> 00:48:04,932 Iran, and so oh everybody getting nervous. "Oh, well, we've always 823 00:48:04,933 --> 00:48:06,866 believed in immigration, but we didn't really have 824 00:48:06,866 --> 00:48:08,932 in mind these particular immigrants. I don't know 825 00:48:08,933 --> 00:48:12,399 why they can't be more vanilla. I have a 826 00:48:12,400 --> 00:48:14,866 commitment to immigration in America, but I just 827 00:48:14,866 --> 00:48:17,132 discovered that it's not as deep as I thought 828 00:48:17,133 --> 00:48:19,599 because these particular immigrants, they make me 829 00:48:19,600 --> 00:48:23,866 uncomfortable. Oh, really?" And then, of course, as 830 00:48:23,866 --> 00:48:26,366 a Black man, I say, "Well, how long you've been in 831 00:48:26,366 --> 00:48:30,532 the country? Well, my grandmother came. Oh, so you 832 00:48:30,533 --> 00:48:32,666 haven't been here that long. What makes you the 833 00:48:32,666 --> 00:48:35,066 definitive authority on defining what is America? 834 00:48:35,266 --> 00:48:37,766 You just got here. I've been here 12 generations. 835 00:48:39,133 --> 00:48:40,199 And I embrace them." 836 00:48:42,433 --> 00:48:45,699 Isn't that interesting? Oh, we got a struggle 837 00:48:45,700 --> 00:48:49,666 going on, right? Serious struggle going on. And so 838 00:48:49,666 --> 00:48:53,466 part of what happened on January 6 was that you 839 00:48:53,466 --> 00:48:57,032 get this backlash deeply xenophobic. You know, 840 00:48:57,033 --> 00:49:01,566 it's anti black, it's anti brown, deeply anti Jewish, 841 00:49:02,233 --> 00:49:07,266 Nazi presence there, deeply anti gay and 842 00:49:07,266 --> 00:49:11,032 lesbian and trans and non binary, deeply 843 00:49:11,033 --> 00:49:15,499 homophobic. You see, I mean, I think those are 844 00:49:15,500 --> 00:49:18,933 salient issues. There are some economic issues as 845 00:49:18,933 --> 00:49:23,866 well that's worth noting, namely that some of 846 00:49:23,866 --> 00:49:28,932 the folk there are suffering economically. But 847 00:49:28,933 --> 00:49:33,533 instead of organizing to confront the most 848 00:49:33,533 --> 00:49:37,533 powerful, they'd rather scapegoat the most 849 00:49:37,533 --> 00:49:42,133 vulnerable. You see, so when, in fact, it looks 850 00:49:42,133 --> 00:49:45,633 like their jobs are precarious, they don't 851 00:49:45,633 --> 00:49:48,699 confront the bosses, they confront our precious 852 00:49:48,700 --> 00:49:51,300 Mexican brothers and sisters in California, for 853 00:49:51,300 --> 00:49:53,866 example. And the Mexican brothers to say "We're not 854 00:49:53,866 --> 00:49:54,566 running nothing. 855 00:49:56,666 --> 00:50:00,366 We don't have power to beat the shape the destiny of your 856 00:50:00,366 --> 00:50:04,432 situation. Yes, there'll be some competition when 857 00:50:04,433 --> 00:50:08,299 we get here, but there's powers at in high places 858 00:50:08,500 --> 00:50:11,733 that created the very context. Why don't you 859 00:50:11,733 --> 00:50:16,733 confront them?" Oh cowardly and not enough vision. 860 00:50:18,900 --> 00:50:20,800 And that's true for Americans, whatever color they 861 00:50:20,800 --> 00:50:23,433 are, because you've got Black folk who also 862 00:50:23,433 --> 00:50:26,199 have anti-immigrant sensibilities against our 863 00:50:26,200 --> 00:50:29,500 precious Mexican brothers and sisters, because they also 864 00:50:29,500 --> 00:50:34,400 accept the mainstream perception rather than get 865 00:50:34,400 --> 00:50:37,766 beneath the mainstream perception. That's what 866 00:50:37,766 --> 00:50:41,466 truth is. Truth is always beneath the superficial 867 00:50:41,466 --> 00:50:45,932 dialogue. Always, beneath. Listen to the Republican 868 00:50:45,933 --> 00:50:48,866 Party. Listen to the Democratic Party. Do you 869 00:50:48,866 --> 00:50:52,666 think either of them are telling the full truth? 870 00:50:53,333 --> 00:50:57,433 No. You got to get beneath. Back, when we talked 871 00:50:57,433 --> 00:51:01,133 about the vocation of intellectual. You look at 872 00:51:01,133 --> 00:51:04,433 the basic assumptions and presuppositions. You 873 00:51:04,433 --> 00:51:09,733 evaluate the evaluations. You evaluate the 874 00:51:09,733 --> 00:51:14,266 framework that people are trying to put us in. We 875 00:51:14,266 --> 00:51:18,366 got to expand the framework. Just to give you one 876 00:51:18,366 --> 00:51:21,332 example, Martin Luther King Jr. was trying to break 877 00:51:21,333 --> 00:51:23,933 the back of American apartheid and he would have 878 00:51:23,933 --> 00:51:26,266 these negotiations, you know, with a number of the 879 00:51:26,733 --> 00:51:29,766 the other white elites in Alabama, they would say, 880 00:51:30,033 --> 00:51:33,333 "Well, you know, Reverend King, we think there 881 00:51:33,333 --> 00:51:37,866 ought to be a liberal version of Jim Crow." What 882 00:51:37,866 --> 00:51:39,832 that would be as well. "Well, you know, we're still 883 00:51:39,833 --> 00:51:42,266 going to have Jim Crow. We're still going to have 884 00:51:42,266 --> 00:51:45,866 segregation, but we'll allow some spaces for the 885 00:51:45,866 --> 00:51:49,832 black middle class to have some opportunities." And 886 00:51:49,833 --> 00:51:54,066 he said, "No, I'm an abolitionist, I want to get beneath 887 00:51:54,533 --> 00:51:59,766 the superficial. I want to abolish Jim Crow. I 888 00:51:59,766 --> 00:52:04,032 don't want a liberal version of Jim Crow." That's 889 00:52:04,033 --> 00:52:06,899 like a liberal version of slavery. "Well, there 890 00:52:06,900 --> 00:52:09,200 have been some slave holders who will treat some of 891 00:52:09,200 --> 00:52:12,333 the slaves very nicely and kindly on the weekend." 892 00:52:13,033 --> 00:52:15,299 No we want to abolish slavery. We don't want a 893 00:52:15,300 --> 00:52:17,966 liberal version of slavery. Well so it is with 894 00:52:17,966 --> 00:52:21,199 poverty for me. So it is with a number of issues. 895 00:52:21,200 --> 00:52:25,400 I want to abolish poverty across the board. I want 896 00:52:25,400 --> 00:52:29,133 to abolish decrepit schools. I want to abolish 897 00:52:29,133 --> 00:52:32,566 student debt. We got to do away with some of this 898 00:52:32,566 --> 00:52:34,799 stuff, you see, and they said, "Oh, you're so 899 00:52:34,800 --> 00:52:40,466 radical?" You don't say. You don't say. Yes, that's 900 00:52:40,466 --> 00:52:43,032 exactly right. Why? Because radical means get to 901 00:52:43,033 --> 00:52:45,466 the root and when you get to the root, you're 902 00:52:45,466 --> 00:52:49,499 going to get beneath the superficial discourse. I 903 00:52:49,500 --> 00:52:52,833 want to abolish patriarchy. "Oh brother West, you're 904 00:52:52,833 --> 00:52:56,166 going too far. I think we're going to have a 905 00:52:56,166 --> 00:52:59,132 moderate version of patriarchy." No, no, no 906 00:52:59,300 --> 00:53:03,000 women's humanity, women's potentiality ought to be 907 00:53:03,000 --> 00:53:05,633 unleashed across the board. I want to abolish 908 00:53:05,633 --> 00:53:08,299 homophobia. You a dreamer? That's right. You got 909 00:53:08,300 --> 00:53:11,133 the right, brother. I'm a freedom dreamer. I'm a 910 00:53:11,133 --> 00:53:15,333 love dreamer. I'm a healing dreamer. And we'll go down 911 00:53:15,333 --> 00:53:19,099 faithful to that dream before the worms get my 912 00:53:19,100 --> 00:53:19,433 body. 913 00:53:29,833 --> 00:53:31,566 Pauline: Gerald, did you want to ask... 914 00:53:34,200 --> 00:53:37,366 So I have the next question, the Central Park 915 00:53:37,366 --> 00:53:39,799 Karen, had criminal charges of making a false 916 00:53:39,800 --> 00:53:43,166 report dropped in New York City. Talk to us about 917 00:53:43,700 --> 00:53:46,233 how the legal system has different standards for 918 00:53:46,233 --> 00:53:47,999 whites and people of color? 919 00:53:50,100 --> 00:53:52,333 Dr. West: Yeah, one, you know, I've been blessed to 920 00:53:52,333 --> 00:53:56,833 teach in prisons since 1977. And 921 00:53:56,833 --> 00:54:00,433 it has been a beautiful, joyful experience. Some 922 00:54:00,433 --> 00:54:03,399 of the most brilliant folks I've ever met have 923 00:54:03,400 --> 00:54:07,466 been behind bars. I've had a student get a Ph.D., 924 00:54:07,466 --> 00:54:09,666 became professor of philosophy, Pace University, 925 00:54:09,666 --> 00:54:12,299 brother Anthony, Anthony Edwards. He died just 926 00:54:12,300 --> 00:54:12,900 recently, 927 00:54:15,333 --> 00:54:18,766 coming right out of jail. And I've seen it go from 928 00:54:18,766 --> 00:54:23,999 two thousand people in jail over to many. I've seen 929 00:54:24,000 --> 00:54:26,200 the expansion of the mass incarceration machine. 930 00:54:26,800 --> 00:54:32,733 Why? Because Black folk, brown folk, have roughly 931 00:54:32,733 --> 00:54:36,199 the same percentage of folks involved in drug 932 00:54:36,500 --> 00:54:41,133 activities, but they're over 60 percent of the 933 00:54:41,133 --> 00:54:46,233 convictions. See, that's racism, at its very deep 934 00:54:46,433 --> 00:54:50,766 level, you see. But it's not just racism, but also class. 935 00:54:52,266 --> 00:54:54,566 It's also class that we talk about poor and 936 00:54:54,566 --> 00:54:58,232 working class Black people. Poor and working class 937 00:54:58,233 --> 00:55:01,233 brown people. It's also poor and working class White 938 00:55:01,233 --> 00:55:03,633 people, but disproportionately black and brown. 939 00:55:04,933 --> 00:55:08,399 And the best example there, of course, is 2008. 940 00:55:09,466 --> 00:55:15,166 You got a massive Wall Street crimes, insider trading, 941 00:55:15,166 --> 00:55:20,799 market manipulation, predatory lending, fraudulent 942 00:55:20,800 --> 00:55:22,766 activities. How many Wall Street executives went 943 00:55:22,766 --> 00:55:29,732 to jail? Zero. Zero. My dear brother, Obama, he met 944 00:55:29,733 --> 00:55:33,566 with them in March of 2009. What did he say? He 945 00:55:33,566 --> 00:55:36,499 said, "I stand between you and the pitchforks that 946 00:55:36,500 --> 00:55:39,933 the people have coming at you, but I will protect 947 00:55:39,933 --> 00:55:42,999 you. I will be on your side." He sided with Wall 948 00:55:43,000 --> 00:55:44,900 Street. He bailed out Wall Street. He didn't bail 949 00:55:44,900 --> 00:55:48,166 out main street. And he and Eric Holder as his 950 00:55:48,166 --> 00:55:50,466 Attorney General, who himself comes out of Wall 951 00:55:50,466 --> 00:55:52,932 Street, both are black, but siding with Wall 952 00:55:52,933 --> 00:55:55,933 Street. And hence I was very critical of them 953 00:55:56,066 --> 00:55:59,899 based on moral and spiritual grounds because it 954 00:55:59,900 --> 00:56:05,633 shows that Wall Street can engage in crimes, and 955 00:56:05,633 --> 00:56:08,933 there's no responsibility. But you get pressure, 956 00:56:08,933 --> 00:56:13,733 Jamal and Latisha committing a crime and they go 957 00:56:13,733 --> 00:56:17,199 straight to jail. You get Jose and Juanita 958 00:56:17,200 --> 00:56:19,733 committing they go straight to jail. So that's both 959 00:56:19,866 --> 00:56:24,099 races and classes. And that needs to be called 960 00:56:24,100 --> 00:56:28,833 into question. We must have a fair rule of law 961 00:56:28,966 --> 00:56:33,966 across the board. And so these are examples of the 962 00:56:33,966 --> 00:56:37,932 ways in which we have to be vigilant with our 963 00:56:37,933 --> 00:56:41,599 voices, we have to be vigilant with our bodies. 964 00:56:41,600 --> 00:56:44,900 That's why some of us hit the streets. Some of us 965 00:56:44,900 --> 00:56:49,300 go to jail, and in the end, someone must be 966 00:56:49,300 --> 00:56:53,566 willing to die, for what we believe. This is what I 967 00:56:53,566 --> 00:56:56,499 tell young people all the time, you know, don't 968 00:56:56,500 --> 00:56:59,633 think of yourself as first and foremost having a 969 00:56:59,633 --> 00:57:03,966 brain. Think of yourself as first and foremost 970 00:57:04,266 --> 00:57:05,832 having a cause. 971 00:57:07,966 --> 00:57:11,466 Now you can use your brand for your cause. You can 972 00:57:11,466 --> 00:57:15,199 use your market for justice. You can use your job, 973 00:57:15,200 --> 00:57:17,966 your career for something bigger than you, but if 974 00:57:17,966 --> 00:57:22,266 all you got is a brain, then you've already sold 975 00:57:22,266 --> 00:57:26,666 your soul for mess of pottage. Because the black 976 00:57:26,666 --> 00:57:31,899 freedom tradition did not engage in sacrifice just 977 00:57:32,366 --> 00:57:36,299 for Black folk to have brands, we came from Africa 978 00:57:36,300 --> 00:57:40,100 and we were branded. Brand on our bodies. 979 00:57:42,500 --> 00:57:47,500 We must use our success for moral and spiritual 980 00:57:47,500 --> 00:57:51,466 greatness. And moral and spiritual greatness has to 981 00:57:51,466 --> 00:57:56,032 do with the quality of service to others. I 982 00:57:56,033 --> 00:57:58,433 believe in the biblical definition of great is he 983 00:57:58,433 --> 00:58:03,099 or she is greatest among you will serve. Whatever 984 00:58:03,100 --> 00:58:07,966 your gifts are, you can sing, like a river, he's 985 00:58:07,966 --> 00:58:11,699 going to render that those gifts in such a way 986 00:58:11,700 --> 00:58:15,633 that she touches your soul. You a doctor like 987 00:58:15,633 --> 00:58:18,999 Charles Drew? He's going to heal in such a way 988 00:58:19,200 --> 00:58:23,566 that the angels sing. You a pharmacist, you a 989 00:58:23,566 --> 00:58:28,032 sanitation worker? You're there to serve. If you're 990 00:58:28,033 --> 00:58:32,166 a student in Ventura County, all the brilliance, 991 00:58:32,366 --> 00:58:35,599 all your sharpness, you still want to use that to 992 00:58:35,600 --> 00:58:40,900 what? Help somebody. To be of service to somebody. 993 00:58:41,100 --> 00:58:45,000 That's a cause, that's not just the brain, and 994 00:58:45,000 --> 00:58:47,100 that's something that needs to be said over and 995 00:58:47,100 --> 00:58:50,766 over again in this society. And of course, so many 996 00:58:50,766 --> 00:58:53,132 young people like yourself, you all understand 997 00:58:53,133 --> 00:58:56,566 what I talk about. You wouldn't be members of the 998 00:58:56,566 --> 00:58:58,466 Black students association, you wouldn't be members of the 999 00:58:58,466 --> 00:59:00,999 student groups that's trying to be a force for 1000 00:59:01,000 --> 00:59:03,666 good, bigger than your own egos, bigger than your 1001 00:59:03,666 --> 00:59:06,566 own careers. You got callings, not just careers. 1002 00:59:10,433 --> 00:59:13,266 Gerald: You are just brilliant. I just have one final 1003 00:59:13,266 --> 00:59:15,232 question and then Pauline will take us into our 1004 00:59:15,233 --> 00:59:19,099 Q&A. So recently, we've seen how your moral and 1005 00:59:19,100 --> 00:59:24,433 spiritual grounding and just activism has caused 1006 00:59:24,433 --> 00:59:26,066 you to get in a little bit of trouble. Some good 1007 00:59:26,066 --> 00:59:29,499 trouble, though. So my question is, on your journey 1008 00:59:29,500 --> 00:59:32,533 of heightened awareness and the dismantling of 1009 00:59:32,533 --> 00:59:35,966 racism, in the fight for human rights, how do you 1010 00:59:35,966 --> 00:59:38,832 find the tenacity to keep up the good fight? What 1011 00:59:38,833 --> 00:59:40,999 inspires you and what motivates you to keep 1012 00:59:41,000 --> 00:59:42,900 fighting for people like us? 1013 00:59:42,900 --> 00:59:44,333 Dr. West: Well, I mean, one is, 1014 00:59:44,333 --> 00:59:47,499 you know, I told you about Cliff and Irene, you see if 1015 00:59:47,666 --> 00:59:50,299 people had a chance to meet my father, you could 1016 00:59:50,300 --> 00:59:54,533 see how far I fall short. You know, I 1017 00:59:54,533 --> 00:59:56,833 could never be the human being he was. He died in 1018 00:59:56,833 --> 01:00:00,299 1994. He's overlooking me all the 1019 01:00:00,300 --> 01:00:02,466 time. You know what I mean? He set such high 1020 01:00:02,466 --> 01:00:04,532 standard. The world doesn't know that much about 1021 01:00:04,533 --> 01:00:07,633 him. I know. The world might think a whole lot 1022 01:00:07,633 --> 01:00:10,999 about me. I said, "You met Dad. You better put me in 1023 01:00:11,000 --> 01:00:16,166 context. You better put me in context." And so that 1024 01:00:16,500 --> 01:00:19,533 to be the second son of Clifton and 1025 01:00:19,533 --> 01:00:24,033 Irene is the greatest honor I've ever had. So I 1026 01:00:24,033 --> 01:00:25,799 know what the standards are, the same is true to 1027 01:00:25,800 --> 01:00:28,233 come out of Shiloh Baptist Church. So by the time 1028 01:00:28,233 --> 01:00:31,399 you get to Martin Luther King Jr., well he's like 1029 01:00:31,400 --> 01:00:34,900 dad and dad's like him, he set a standard. Now, all 1030 01:00:34,900 --> 01:00:36,300 of these are human beings. What does that mean? 1031 01:00:36,433 --> 01:00:39,733 They got faults. They got foibles. Dad wasn't 1032 01:00:39,733 --> 01:00:43,633 perfect. But the basic orientation of his mind, 1033 01:00:43,633 --> 01:00:47,299 heart, and soul, and body was to treat people right. 1034 01:00:48,200 --> 01:00:52,033 To have integrity. To have honesty. To have a 1035 01:00:52,033 --> 01:00:54,233 sensitivity to the suffering of others, no matter 1036 01:00:54,233 --> 01:00:57,666 who they are, and a generosity to others, you see. 1037 01:00:58,566 --> 01:01:02,699 And as long as I have memories of, as long as I 1038 01:01:02,700 --> 01:01:05,533 know what the standards are, I'm willing to pay 1039 01:01:05,533 --> 01:01:09,533 whatever price it is, with a smile too. Now, with a 1040 01:01:09,533 --> 01:01:12,233 little style, not as much style as both of y'all. Both of y'all 1041 01:01:12,233 --> 01:01:14,333 got a whole lot style. I'm trying to catch up on 1042 01:01:14,333 --> 01:01:18,866 style front, but certainly with a smile. Because 1043 01:01:18,866 --> 01:01:23,466 we start with gratitude. Life was a gift. Struggle 1044 01:01:23,466 --> 01:01:28,932 is a gift. Sanity is a gift. And we have to be 1045 01:01:28,933 --> 01:01:32,733 willing to pay back with that gift. Our very 1046 01:01:32,733 --> 01:01:36,499 service is a form of giving, and in the end, your 1047 01:01:36,500 --> 01:01:40,800 life is a gift. So that when you think of the gift 1048 01:01:41,166 --> 01:01:46,032 character and the gift quality of our lives, then 1049 01:01:46,033 --> 01:01:50,133 you have gratitude, as well as sometimes some 1050 01:01:50,133 --> 01:01:55,199 attitude. Attitude and a sense of, "Don't mess with 1051 01:01:55,200 --> 01:01:58,700 me because I don't put up with disrespect." I'm a 1052 01:01:58,700 --> 01:02:00,733 son to Clifton, and Irene. Y'all may not 1053 01:02:00,733 --> 01:02:02,966 understand what that means, but I know what it 1054 01:02:02,966 --> 01:02:06,932 means. You see, I don't play no games when it comes 1055 01:02:06,933 --> 01:02:10,533 to Cliff and Irene, because they stand too tall. 1056 01:02:11,066 --> 01:02:13,399 And I see the same thing in your precious parents 1057 01:02:13,400 --> 01:02:18,600 right there behind you. Same commitment to dignity. 1058 01:02:18,600 --> 01:02:21,066 Sister Pauline, she got the same thing, even though 1059 01:02:21,066 --> 01:02:23,299 she ain't got the pictures of her parents in the 1060 01:02:23,300 --> 01:02:26,300 back. We can still see them. We can still see them. 1061 01:02:27,233 --> 01:02:30,166 The love that they put inside of both of you all 1062 01:02:30,466 --> 01:02:33,899 for you to be the most excellent ones, the morally, 1063 01:02:33,900 --> 01:02:38,066 spiritually great ones, that is a magnificent gift. 1064 01:02:38,200 --> 01:02:41,466 We must never, ever, ever forget it and never 1065 01:02:41,466 --> 01:02:44,799 allow the world to take away that joy and that 1066 01:02:44,800 --> 01:02:48,366 memory. Never allow the world to take that 1067 01:02:48,366 --> 01:02:48,632 away. 1068 01:02:51,633 --> 01:02:56,099 Pauline: Thank you, Dr. West. I just have one question, one 1069 01:02:56,100 --> 01:02:59,033 more question, and then we will go into the Q and 1070 01:02:59,033 --> 01:03:04,899 A. Your situation at Harvard. Why do you think you 1071 01:03:04,900 --> 01:03:07,066 have not been tenured? 1072 01:03:07,066 --> 01:03:09,466 Dr. West: Well, you know, there could only be 1073 01:03:09,466 --> 01:03:13,399 three reasons. One is because I'm too old and I am 1074 01:03:13,400 --> 01:03:15,533 getting older. There's no doubt about that. But I 1075 01:03:15,533 --> 01:03:18,833 still get a lot of energy. But there's been other 1076 01:03:18,833 --> 01:03:21,966 professors who were, who underwent tenure 1077 01:03:21,966 --> 01:03:25,632 process and received tenure, who are older than me. So 1078 01:03:25,633 --> 01:03:28,333 I figured it couldn't be age for the most part. 1079 01:03:28,333 --> 01:03:30,766 Some people say, "Well, his best works are behind 1080 01:03:30,766 --> 01:03:33,166 him." Well, I've got the Gifford Lectures. This 1081 01:03:33,166 --> 01:03:35,932 is very prestigious set of lectures in Edinburgh, 1082 01:03:35,933 --> 01:03:39,533 Scotland, people even state that Gifford Lectures, 1083 01:03:39,533 --> 01:03:42,766 the kind of Nobel Prize in Philosophy. So that 1084 01:03:42,766 --> 01:03:45,166 committee invites me to give the Gifford Lectures 1085 01:03:45,166 --> 01:03:48,332 three years from now. They're saying, "We think brother 1086 01:03:48,333 --> 01:03:51,966 West still has something to say." It can't be 1087 01:03:52,366 --> 01:03:55,932 that everything that I have, that I will contribute 1088 01:03:55,933 --> 01:03:59,666 is behind me. So it can't be age. It can't be academics, 1089 01:03:59,833 --> 01:04:02,699 because if I got twenty two books. I got tenure 1090 01:04:02,700 --> 01:04:06,133 thirty seven years ago at Yale. University 1091 01:04:06,133 --> 01:04:08,866 Professor at Harvard, University Professor at 1092 01:04:08,866 --> 01:04:11,899 Princeton, what is University Professor, the highest honor 1093 01:04:11,900 --> 01:04:15,033 for a faculty member. So it couldn't be academics. 1094 01:04:15,033 --> 01:04:18,333 So it had to be politics. It had to be politics, 1095 01:04:18,333 --> 01:04:20,366 and I don't think my support of my dear brother 1096 01:04:20,366 --> 01:04:23,599 Bernie Sanders, upsets the powers that be at Harvard. 1097 01:04:24,533 --> 01:04:26,466 Now, Bernie, you know, he could be 1098 01:04:26,466 --> 01:04:29,566 viewed as a radical brother, but he's still part 1099 01:04:29,733 --> 01:04:32,733 of a kind of mainstreams within the Democratic 1100 01:04:32,733 --> 01:04:35,733 Party. So what other issues could it be? Well, 1101 01:04:35,733 --> 01:04:39,299 this is where I zero in on the Israeli-Palestinian 1102 01:04:39,300 --> 01:04:43,333 issue, that I'm thoroughly convinced that it is 1103 01:04:43,333 --> 01:04:47,866 precisely my outspokenness against the mainstream 1104 01:04:48,266 --> 01:04:52,532 that deeply upsets a Harvard administration who 1105 01:04:52,533 --> 01:04:55,933 would have to give their stamp of approval on 1106 01:04:55,933 --> 01:04:58,933 someone who is so critical of the Israeli 1107 01:04:58,933 --> 01:05:02,099 occupation and actually supports the boycott, 1108 01:05:02,100 --> 01:05:04,833 and divestment and sanctions movement. And once you 1109 01:05:04,833 --> 01:05:07,999 accept once you support that movement, you usually 1110 01:05:08,000 --> 01:05:10,466 usually cast as being an anti Jewish or 1111 01:05:10,466 --> 01:05:13,832 anti-Semitic person. And I say, "You can call me 1112 01:05:13,833 --> 01:05:18,366 any name you want," but I'm never going to 1113 01:05:18,366 --> 01:05:21,866 stoop as low as to hate Jews. I'm never going to 1114 01:05:21,866 --> 01:05:24,832 stoop as low to hate any group. But I do hate 1115 01:05:24,833 --> 01:05:28,466 injustice. And any group that promotes or 1116 01:05:28,466 --> 01:05:32,266 perpetuates injustice will receive my moral 1117 01:05:32,266 --> 01:05:37,066 critique and my witness, and I'll be in solidarity 1118 01:05:37,566 --> 01:05:41,266 with the folk who are suffering. And so just an 1119 01:05:41,266 --> 01:05:43,966 attempt to try to think of what could be the 1120 01:05:43,966 --> 01:05:45,932 reasons, what are the grounds of the reasons, 1121 01:05:45,933 --> 01:05:47,033 that's my conclusion. 1122 01:05:55,400 --> 01:05:58,500 Gerald: Do you ever regret having these political stances 1123 01:05:58,500 --> 01:06:00,366 because of the repercussions that you're getting? 1124 01:06:01,600 --> 01:06:09,033 Dr. West: No, not at all. No, not at all. Definitely. Not at 1125 01:06:09,033 --> 01:06:12,299 all. [Gerald]: Just know if you need me in Cambridge, I'll 1126 01:06:12,300 --> 01:06:13,166 be right there with... 1127 01:06:15,366 --> 01:06:18,932 Dr. West: You and sister Pauline, you all have some magnificent 1128 01:06:18,933 --> 01:06:22,499 work still to do there in Ventura, so I can 1129 01:06:22,500 --> 01:06:26,433 feel your support and solidarity across the nation, 1130 01:06:26,733 --> 01:06:30,499 but you all stay on work that you're doing. You 1131 01:06:30,500 --> 01:06:32,600 know what I mean? That's what I should be saying, 1132 01:06:32,600 --> 01:06:34,833 is any way I can be supportive, I'm going to give 1133 01:06:34,833 --> 01:06:37,866 you my phone number, in any way I can be supportive, 1134 01:06:37,866 --> 01:06:40,532 you let me know. Because it's very important that 1135 01:06:40,533 --> 01:06:44,199 the younger generation be connected to the 1136 01:06:44,200 --> 01:06:46,933 struggles for integrity and honesty, struggles for 1137 01:06:46,933 --> 01:06:52,566 love and justice. [Gerald]: Right. So we have a question 1138 01:06:52,566 --> 01:06:55,999 from Adam in the Q&A, "Over the summer, we have seen 1139 01:06:56,000 --> 01:06:58,033 the movement to defund the police become 1140 01:06:58,033 --> 01:07:00,499 relatively mainstream. What do you think of this 1141 01:07:00,500 --> 01:07:03,233 movement? Do you think that the police and prisons 1142 01:07:03,233 --> 01:07:06,433 are obsolete? What does the phrase for 1143 01:07:06,433 --> 01:07:09,166 Michelle Alexander re-imagined justice mean to you? 1144 01:07:10,833 --> 01:07:12,999 Dr. West: Wonderful question. Michelle Alexander, she's my 1145 01:07:13,000 --> 01:07:15,566 dear sister. She teaches at the Great Union Theological 1146 01:07:15,566 --> 01:07:18,366 Seminary in New York. I've spent so much time we'll 1147 01:07:18,366 --> 01:07:22,632 probably end up going back there. I think that one 1148 01:07:22,633 --> 01:07:26,533 we've got to start at the top. There's already 1149 01:07:26,533 --> 01:07:30,533 been massive defunding of the police in terms of 1150 01:07:31,033 --> 01:07:34,666 the institution that's supposed to police Wall 1151 01:07:34,666 --> 01:07:40,099 Street. They call it deregulation. Defund it. Take 1152 01:07:40,100 --> 01:07:43,400 the money out of it. Wall Street runs free. No 1153 01:07:43,400 --> 01:07:48,633 regulation. No policing. So the from the very 1154 01:07:48,633 --> 01:07:50,966 beginning, we have to always put it within the 1155 01:07:50,966 --> 01:07:55,599 larger framework. There has been a defunding of 1156 01:07:55,600 --> 01:08:00,900 the police of the Pentagon. You see, the Pentagon gets 1157 01:08:00,900 --> 01:08:04,000 big money, who's going to police the Pentagon? 1158 01:08:04,100 --> 01:08:06,966 Hardly anybody, they don't have no money. They do what they 1159 01:08:06,966 --> 01:08:10,566 want. Just like Wall Street. Do what they want. It 1160 01:08:10,566 --> 01:08:12,932 only becomes the issue defunding the police when 1161 01:08:12,933 --> 01:08:16,733 you talk about poor people, Black people. You see. 1162 01:08:17,133 --> 01:08:22,899 Why? Because the intent of the police when it 1163 01:08:22,900 --> 01:08:27,733 comes to poor people to contain and suppress too 1164 01:08:27,733 --> 01:08:30,599 often. But this is not true across the board, I 1165 01:08:30,600 --> 01:08:34,566 heard actually the mayor and the police chief 1166 01:08:35,000 --> 01:08:38,300 in Ventura, back this summer. I think it is 1167 01:08:38,300 --> 01:08:41,266 Lavere, what's his name? Lavere 1168 01:08:41,900 --> 01:08:44,633 and the police, and they were talking about how 1169 01:08:44,633 --> 01:08:47,366 they have to be committed to treating Black and 1170 01:08:47,366 --> 01:08:51,332 brown people with humanity. I agree wholeheartedly. 1171 01:08:52,166 --> 01:08:55,532 Wholeheartedly. But it's going to be a matter of 1172 01:08:55,533 --> 01:08:59,433 ensuring that the police themselves are 1173 01:08:59,433 --> 01:09:03,166 accountable. The Wall Street elites haven't been 1174 01:09:03,166 --> 01:09:06,632 accountable. They got away with it. You see. The 1175 01:09:06,633 --> 01:09:10,299 police doing wonderful things. We applaud. Police 1176 01:09:10,300 --> 01:09:12,566 doing negative things. You don't just come out and 1177 01:09:12,566 --> 01:09:15,332 say, we're sorry they're doing it. You say they 1178 01:09:15,333 --> 01:09:18,999 must be accountable. If the police killing people, 1179 01:09:19,333 --> 01:09:21,466 they need to have a fair trial and go to a fair 1180 01:09:21,466 --> 01:09:24,866 trial and go to jail. How many policemen actually 1181 01:09:24,866 --> 01:09:27,299 go to jail, given all these folk who get killed? 1182 01:09:27,400 --> 01:09:30,333 Hardly anybody. It means they're not serious about 1183 01:09:30,333 --> 01:09:32,766 accountability. See what I mean? And you have to 1184 01:09:32,766 --> 01:09:36,099 say that. And when you say it, well, they say, "Oh, 1185 01:09:36,100 --> 01:09:39,166 wow, you hate the police? I don't hate the police. 1186 01:09:39,166 --> 01:09:42,166 I hate the police killing folk. I hate the 1187 01:09:42,166 --> 01:09:45,999 police brutalized. I hate to see the police get 1188 01:09:46,000 --> 01:09:49,000 killed. I hate to see the police get brutalized, but 1189 01:09:49,000 --> 01:09:52,300 I'm against brutalization across the board and 1190 01:09:52,300 --> 01:09:54,866 trying to be consistent means getting misunderstood. 1191 01:09:56,133 --> 01:09:58,499 Because oftentimes people want to protect one 1192 01:09:58,500 --> 01:10:00,600 group and they don't want the other group to be 1193 01:10:00,600 --> 01:10:04,366 accountable. So that the defunding the police simply 1194 01:10:04,366 --> 01:10:08,332 means having a system of law enforcement where you 1195 01:10:08,333 --> 01:10:11,533 treat Black and brown people with respect, and 1196 01:10:11,533 --> 01:10:17,033 when you don't, you are accountable. You have to 1197 01:10:17,033 --> 01:10:19,999 pay consequences in the same way that any other 1198 01:10:20,000 --> 01:10:23,266 citizen who brutalizes other people has to be 1199 01:10:23,433 --> 01:10:26,299 accountable. I'm sorry, that's a long answer, but 1200 01:10:26,300 --> 01:10:28,433 we have to keep the larger context in 1201 01:10:28,433 --> 01:10:33,366 mind because, you know, it's just going on for so 1202 01:10:33,366 --> 01:10:37,799 long. I mean, I don't know of a Black man in 1203 01:10:37,800 --> 01:10:42,833 America who hasn't had a negative and ugly 1204 01:10:42,833 --> 01:10:46,266 encounter with the police. I've had so many I 1205 01:10:46,266 --> 01:10:47,332 can't even count. 1206 01:10:49,633 --> 01:10:52,566 I mean, and it's just a reality. My brother, my 1207 01:10:52,566 --> 01:10:57,799 father, my son, my grandson, across the board. And 1208 01:10:57,800 --> 01:11:00,266 people want to act as if, "Well, you just got to 1209 01:11:00,266 --> 01:11:03,132 get used to it, you want to normalize it," no 1210 01:11:04,100 --> 01:11:08,000 because when it happens to somebody else, it can 1211 01:11:08,000 --> 01:11:11,333 become a major crisis. But what happens to Black 1212 01:11:11,333 --> 01:11:15,299 folk we supposed to get used to it. No. No way. No 1213 01:11:15,300 --> 01:11:18,933 way. No. I know you guys got some other questions. I'm sorry 1214 01:11:18,933 --> 01:11:23,299 go. [Pauline]: Thank you for I think a lot of people 1215 01:11:23,300 --> 01:11:26,266 needed to hear the comment about you saying I 1216 01:11:26,266 --> 01:11:30,499 don't know any I mean, sorry, I'm trying to read 1217 01:11:30,500 --> 01:11:34,066 my thoughts. I don't know any Black man that 1218 01:11:34,066 --> 01:11:37,566 hasn't gone through police brutality. And I'm so, 1219 01:11:37,566 --> 01:11:40,699 so glad you said that. So thank you for that. I 1220 01:11:40,700 --> 01:11:43,500 just like to mention one more thing. We have a lot 1221 01:11:43,500 --> 01:11:46,666 an overflow of questions. We will not be able to 1222 01:11:46,666 --> 01:11:50,466 get to a lot of them, but we will choose a few. So, 1223 01:11:51,133 --> 01:11:54,899 given that we have a question from Dina. "I am a 1224 01:11:54,900 --> 01:11:57,900 Puerto Rican, gay woman who wants to love out loud. 1225 01:11:58,366 --> 01:12:01,299 Sometimes that gets me in trouble. What advice do 1226 01:12:01,300 --> 01:12:05,866 you have for me?" [Dr. West]: One is you want to be in contact 1227 01:12:05,866 --> 01:12:08,799 with that rich tradition of Puerto Rican brothers and 1228 01:12:08,800 --> 01:12:11,533 sisters, Julia de Burgos, one of the greatest 1229 01:12:11,533 --> 01:12:15,533 poets of the 20th century. She was wrestling with 1230 01:12:15,533 --> 01:12:19,133 her forms of sexuality, but she was also a love 1231 01:12:19,133 --> 01:12:21,433 warrior and a freedom fighter and a wounded healer. 1232 01:12:21,433 --> 01:12:24,933 She died there in Harlem. But what you 1233 01:12:24,933 --> 01:12:28,366 want is you always want to be connected with 1234 01:12:28,366 --> 01:12:31,832 voices, voices of the dead that come through books 1235 01:12:32,766 --> 01:12:36,232 or internet. Voices of the quick. Voices of those 1236 01:12:36,233 --> 01:12:39,366 who are alive, that you can still hear, you see. 1237 01:12:39,800 --> 01:12:43,133 And the Puerto Rican traditions, especially that 1238 01:12:43,133 --> 01:12:45,533 Puerto Rican tradition that radically calls into 1239 01:12:45,533 --> 01:12:48,666 question US colonialism, going all the way back to 1240 01:12:48,666 --> 01:12:53,466 Albizu Campos and Lolita Lebron, music of 1241 01:12:53,466 --> 01:12:58,699 Hernandez and the Puerto Rican culture is the hybrid 1242 01:12:58,700 --> 01:13:01,300 culture, of course, Indigenous peoples, there's 1243 01:13:01,300 --> 01:13:05,200 African peoples and European peoples all mixed 1244 01:13:05,200 --> 01:13:08,033 together in blood and culture and so forth. So you 1245 01:13:08,033 --> 01:13:10,333 want to use that as wind at your back the same way 1246 01:13:10,333 --> 01:13:12,933 when I was talking about Donny Hathaway, and Curtis 1247 01:13:12,933 --> 01:13:15,966 Mayfield, Aretha Franklin, and John Coltrane, and 1248 01:13:17,933 --> 01:13:20,666 Sarah Vaughan, I mean, that's my particular 1249 01:13:20,933 --> 01:13:24,733 culture that keeps me on the right track, allows 1250 01:13:24,733 --> 01:13:27,466 me to preserve my sanity, because living in 1251 01:13:27,466 --> 01:13:31,332 America as a Black man, you could go crazy. But it 1252 01:13:31,333 --> 01:13:35,666 also preserves my dignity and my generosity. 1253 01:13:35,666 --> 01:13:38,032 Coltrane You're Blowing a Love Supreme. That's not 1254 01:13:38,033 --> 01:13:43,466 just a song. That's a way of life. How you doin' 1255 01:13:43,466 --> 01:13:47,666 Coltrane? Because I had my mother. I had my father. 1256 01:13:47,666 --> 01:13:52,499 I had Monk and the others keeping me on the right 1257 01:13:52,500 --> 01:13:56,133 track. Clifford Brown and Mary Lou Williams. That 1258 01:13:56,133 --> 01:13:59,866 was my community. And he had Amazigh in 1259 01:13:59,866 --> 01:14:03,766 church, his grandfather was a great pastor that he 1260 01:14:03,766 --> 01:14:06,899 had all of those folk inside of him. Sister Pauline, 1261 01:14:07,066 --> 01:14:09,732 you got the same kind of love inside of you coming 1262 01:14:09,733 --> 01:14:12,899 out of your respected tradition. Brother Gerald, you 1263 01:14:12,900 --> 01:14:15,000 got similar love coming out of you, out of your 1264 01:14:15,000 --> 01:14:17,466 respected tradition. You got to hold on to that 1265 01:14:18,366 --> 01:14:22,399 because so much of the world is trying to tease 1266 01:14:22,400 --> 01:14:27,366 that out of you. So you end up not tied to freedom, 1267 01:14:27,500 --> 01:14:31,266 not tied to love, not tied to healing, and most 1268 01:14:31,266 --> 01:14:36,332 importantly, they want to make you scared. You see, 1269 01:14:36,633 --> 01:14:38,866 they want to keep you afraid. 1270 01:14:40,966 --> 01:14:45,466 And the Puerto Rican tradition has always said the 1271 01:14:45,466 --> 01:14:50,499 great ones had rather be dead than afraid. Mary 1272 01:14:50,500 --> 01:14:53,633 Ellen Pleasant, a Black sister who was there in San 1273 01:14:53,633 --> 01:14:58,533 Francisco, first multi-million man in the Black 1274 01:14:58,533 --> 01:15:01,566 community. Madam Walker was number two. She was 1275 01:15:01,566 --> 01:15:04,166 the first one. She married a White brother who was 1276 01:15:04,166 --> 01:15:06,632 a rather baron. He dropped dead. So she got all his 1277 01:15:06,633 --> 01:15:09,666 money and she became the founder of human rights 1278 01:15:09,666 --> 01:15:12,432 in California in terms of generating all these 1279 01:15:12,433 --> 01:15:15,666 different centers and so on. She gave John Brown a 1280 01:15:15,666 --> 01:15:17,999 White brother who died for Black people. She gave 1281 01:15:18,000 --> 01:15:21,400 him nine hundred thousand dollars in 1858. And that's 1282 01:15:21,400 --> 01:15:24,766 the year before he attacked harpers ferry. And what did 1283 01:15:24,766 --> 01:15:27,632 she used to say? She started to speak. "I'd rather 1284 01:15:27,633 --> 01:15:34,466 be a corpse than a coward." Everybody don't 1285 01:15:34,466 --> 01:15:38,732 have to follow that, but you know what the standard is. 1286 01:15:39,133 --> 01:15:42,199 Stay away from cowardliness. Stay away from being 1287 01:15:42,200 --> 01:15:43,700 afraid, and that doesn't mean you want to be 1288 01:15:43,700 --> 01:15:46,833 corpse quit, but it means you're not going to 1289 01:15:46,833 --> 01:15:50,699 fall into being scared and afraid. You see, that's 1290 01:15:50,700 --> 01:15:53,500 the crucial thing, because as long as we're afraid 1291 01:15:53,500 --> 01:15:59,066 and scared, people, don't want to get in trouble 1292 01:15:59,066 --> 01:16:00,132 as brother John Lewis said. 1293 01:16:05,933 --> 01:16:08,866 Gerald: Beautifully said with that, I will pass it on to 1294 01:16:08,866 --> 01:16:11,166 Ka Ren MacCalla, so she has some questions from the 1295 01:16:11,166 --> 01:16:11,799 live audience. 1296 01:16:17,600 --> 01:16:23,766 Ka Ren: Hello, this is a question from Matthew Morris, he 1297 01:16:23,766 --> 01:16:27,732 asked, "How do we hold our academic institutions 1298 01:16:27,733 --> 01:16:30,866 accountable for the negligent atmosphere that has 1299 01:16:30,866 --> 01:16:33,766 led to so many spiritual and mental deaths of 1300 01:16:33,766 --> 01:16:37,332 Black men and women? How do you know they have had 1301 01:16:37,333 --> 01:16:39,599 enough since these institutions don't already have 1302 01:16:39,600 --> 01:16:42,133 a clear picture of when the goals of equitable 1303 01:16:42,133 --> 01:16:44,233 treatment is meant to heal our campus and student 1304 01:16:44,233 --> 01:16:48,133 body? [Dr. West]: Oh, that's a heavy one, my dear sister 1305 01:16:48,133 --> 01:16:53,033 Ka Ren. I know sister Trinity also got her powerful views 1306 01:16:53,033 --> 01:16:56,499 on this. We all in it together. But I come back to 1307 01:16:56,500 --> 01:16:59,733 this issue of accountability. But the 1308 01:16:59,733 --> 01:17:03,366 accountability is the level of students, at the 1309 01:17:03,366 --> 01:17:06,466 level of staff, I'm talking about the labor force, 1310 01:17:06,766 --> 01:17:09,966 and the level of administration, faculty, and all the 1311 01:17:09,966 --> 01:17:13,299 way up to president. Now, how do we keep each other 1312 01:17:13,300 --> 01:17:16,400 accountable so that we all are committed to 1313 01:17:16,400 --> 01:17:20,033 treating each other decently and with respect? 1314 01:17:20,400 --> 01:17:22,733 Because you're so right. There's been so many 1315 01:17:22,733 --> 01:17:28,133 casualties. So many causalities. If I was not a strong, 1316 01:17:28,133 --> 01:17:30,566 free Black man, I'd be a casualty right now. 1317 01:17:32,666 --> 01:17:35,832 But I don't worry about it because I got my armor 1318 01:17:35,833 --> 01:17:41,566 together. See, I'm ever ready. I'm never surprised 1319 01:17:41,766 --> 01:17:46,232 at evil. I'm never paralyzed by despair. I'm a 1320 01:17:46,233 --> 01:17:50,599 blues man. Blues man can take any catastrophe with 1321 01:17:50,600 --> 01:17:54,633 style and a smile and keep moving. Doesn't mean you're not 1322 01:17:54,633 --> 01:17:56,899 wounded. Doesn't mean you're not scarred, doesn't mean 1323 01:17:56,900 --> 01:18:00,500 you're not torn, but you just keep on moving. 1324 01:18:00,500 --> 01:18:03,833 Curtis Mayfield said what? Keep on pushing. Keep 1325 01:18:03,833 --> 01:18:09,233 on pushing with your eyes toward the standards of 1326 01:18:09,233 --> 01:18:13,599 excellence. See, but, I've been blessed in a 1327 01:18:13,600 --> 01:18:16,733 certain way. And you are so right. That's what 1328 01:18:16,733 --> 01:18:19,633 your question is so heart felt for all of us, no 1329 01:18:19,633 --> 01:18:22,233 matter what color we are. The last thing we want 1330 01:18:22,233 --> 01:18:26,133 in Ventura County, is folks falling through the 1331 01:18:26,133 --> 01:18:30,199 cracks, precious students falling through the 1332 01:18:30,200 --> 01:18:32,166 cracks. Of course, we don't care what color, but 1333 01:18:32,166 --> 01:18:36,399 so often it's disproportionately our precious Black 1334 01:18:36,400 --> 01:18:42,600 brothers and sisters, brown brothers and sisters, 1335 01:18:42,600 --> 01:18:46,700 and so forth, you see. And we've got to keep the 1336 01:18:46,700 --> 01:18:48,800 pressure on the accountability, take the form of 1337 01:18:48,800 --> 01:18:52,233 pressure, intellectual pressure, moral pressure, 1338 01:18:53,033 --> 01:18:56,833 spiritual pressure, and institutional pressure. 1339 01:18:59,333 --> 01:19:01,633 Is that begin to get the get at that question? 1340 01:19:01,633 --> 01:19:02,633 You think to sister Ka Ren? 1341 01:19:12,300 --> 01:19:16,366 Oh do you have that mute on? You have that mute. [Ka Ren]: I'm sorry. [Dr. West]: Oh, 1342 01:19:16,366 --> 01:19:18,699 yeah, no, there it is, absolutely, absolutely. 1343 01:19:22,433 --> 01:19:27,333 Ka Ren: The next question is, "How can we move our nation 1344 01:19:27,333 --> 01:19:29,833 towards representation that includes a broader 1345 01:19:29,833 --> 01:19:34,333 range of values?" [Dr. West]: Well, it's got to be my example. 1346 01:19:35,133 --> 01:19:37,899 It's got to be one example. We have to try to 1347 01:19:37,900 --> 01:19:40,733 build the kind of person that we talk about and 1348 01:19:40,733 --> 01:19:45,666 calling for. And see what happens it's the great 1349 01:19:45,666 --> 01:19:49,499 examples that generates the possibilities of 1350 01:19:49,500 --> 01:19:50,233 awakening. 1351 01:19:52,866 --> 01:19:57,466 That's the key. That's the real key. If you seek 1352 01:19:57,466 --> 01:20:01,766 people who exemplify a level of vision and 1353 01:20:01,766 --> 01:20:05,066 integrity and love and justice, and you decide 1354 01:20:05,433 --> 01:20:08,433 "That's how I want to be," you get enough people 1355 01:20:08,433 --> 01:20:11,133 like that, you can have an awakening that's 1356 01:20:11,133 --> 01:20:14,333 broad. It's just like religion, right? 1357 01:20:16,866 --> 01:20:21,699 People see Muhammad, you see Jesus, you see Esther, 1358 01:20:21,700 --> 01:20:26,666 Amos, you say, "They got something to say." And 1359 01:20:26,766 --> 01:20:31,599 their are examples that I want to imitate. Or you 1360 01:20:31,600 --> 01:20:36,733 see Malcolm X, you see Martin King, you see Fannie Lou 1361 01:20:36,733 --> 01:20:40,166 Hamer, you see Edward Said, "I want to be like you," 1362 01:20:40,166 --> 01:20:46,532 you see Rabbi Abraham Joshua Heschel, overflowing with 1363 01:20:46,533 --> 01:20:49,299 love and justice, like Baal Shem Tov, one 1364 01:20:49,300 --> 01:20:52,900 of the great figures in Judaism, overflowing with 1365 01:20:52,900 --> 01:20:56,033 love, you say, "Oh, I want to be like that." And if 1366 01:20:56,033 --> 01:20:59,099 enough people make that decision, then you got an 1367 01:20:59,100 --> 01:21:02,700 awakening and a movement. We saw with brother 1368 01:21:02,700 --> 01:21:05,533 Floyd Junior, right, we're not going to put up 1369 01:21:05,533 --> 01:21:09,099 with public lynchings of precious Black brothers 1370 01:21:09,700 --> 01:21:11,700 and we're going to hit the street. How come? 1371 01:21:12,033 --> 01:21:14,599 Because we're following the opposite of that. We 1372 01:21:14,600 --> 01:21:17,966 don't want to be like the police who did that. We 1373 01:21:17,966 --> 01:21:20,132 don't want to be like the institutional racism 1374 01:21:20,133 --> 01:21:22,866 that allowed for that. And who are the 1375 01:21:22,866 --> 01:21:26,432 counterexamples for that, well you got a whole 1376 01:21:26,433 --> 01:21:29,433 slew of possibilities and they come in all colors. 1377 01:21:29,666 --> 01:21:33,332 I want to be like Cesar Chavez. I want to be...I want to be, you see what I mean? 1378 01:21:33,333 --> 01:21:35,333 It goes on and on. I want to be like... 1379 01:21:35,333 --> 01:21:39,166 I want to be like Dorothy Day, all of these 1380 01:21:39,166 --> 01:21:41,232 people, all these household names. Why? Because 1381 01:21:41,233 --> 01:21:43,899 they exemplify love and justice. People need to 1382 01:21:43,900 --> 01:21:47,966 know who they are. You see. Now, you hear Stevie Wonder is 1383 01:21:47,966 --> 01:21:50,299 the greatest love warrior in music in his generation, 1384 01:21:50,300 --> 01:21:52,033 what's he thinking about doing right now? You all know 1385 01:21:52,033 --> 01:21:52,399 about that? 1386 01:21:54,533 --> 01:21:58,566 Well he thinking about moving to Ghana, forever. He 1387 01:21:58,566 --> 01:22:00,399 said he can't take the white supremacy in America 1388 01:22:00,400 --> 01:22:03,533 no more. He can't take his kids being disrespected. 1389 01:22:03,533 --> 01:22:06,266 Stevie Wonder, who wrote Love in Need to Love. 1390 01:22:06,966 --> 01:22:08,399 Stevie Wonder, who wrote some of the most 1391 01:22:08,400 --> 01:22:14,500 beautiful love songs of the 20th century. See, you 1392 01:22:14,500 --> 01:22:18,266 said, "Oh, Stevie. You feel the same thing I'm 1393 01:22:18,266 --> 01:22:20,932 feeling?" And of course, he's thinking of going to 1394 01:22:20,933 --> 01:22:25,199 Ghana like who? W.E.B. Du Bois. The great Du Bois didn't he 1395 01:22:25,200 --> 01:22:27,666 leave the country? He went to Ghana. Said, "I'm 1396 01:22:27,666 --> 01:22:30,266 never coming back. I can't take this disrespect." 1397 01:22:31,566 --> 01:22:35,932 That's W.E.B. Du Bois, first Ph.D. at Harvard University, 1398 01:22:35,933 --> 01:22:39,199 1895. He went to Ghana. Now, Stevie, thinking 1399 01:22:39,200 --> 01:22:43,166 about going to Ghana and you say to yourself, "My god, 1400 01:22:43,500 --> 01:22:46,533 we know it's been out of control. We've got to be 1401 01:22:46,533 --> 01:22:49,166 more fortified. We've got to be willing to fight 1402 01:22:49,166 --> 01:22:52,266 even more. You know, the Black brothers are feeling that 1403 01:22:52,266 --> 01:22:55,066 way, we know how so many Black sisters must be 1404 01:22:55,066 --> 01:22:57,932 feeling, because they got to deal with sexism and 1405 01:22:57,933 --> 01:23:01,933 patriarchy too. The same would be true with the 1406 01:23:01,933 --> 01:23:04,766 Black gays and lesbians and so forth, but all of 1407 01:23:04,766 --> 01:23:06,966 us can't go to Ghana. I mean, you know me, I know 1408 01:23:06,966 --> 01:23:09,966 I'm not going to Ghana, at all. My mama's in 1409 01:23:09,966 --> 01:23:12,032 Sacramento, I ain't going nowhere. 1410 01:23:13,533 --> 01:23:15,899 They're going to put me in the grave before they push me 1411 01:23:15,900 --> 01:23:19,633 out of the country, but I appreciate the freedom of folk who 1412 01:23:19,633 --> 01:23:23,199 want to leave. Can take it no more. Everybody got 1413 01:23:23,200 --> 01:23:25,566 the right to choose, to lift every voice, choose 1414 01:23:25,566 --> 01:23:28,699 for yourself. But if Stevie Wonder's thinking that 1415 01:23:28,700 --> 01:23:32,266 way and we know he got more cash then all of us. You 1416 01:23:32,266 --> 01:23:34,166 know what I mean? 1417 01:23:36,266 --> 01:23:38,966 "What's happening inside of his soul, all of that love 1418 01:23:38,966 --> 01:23:42,099 he still has for humanity?" but it begins with 1419 01:23:42,100 --> 01:23:45,266 Black people for Stevie Wonder. And you all know 1420 01:23:45,266 --> 01:23:46,166 Stevie's music, right? 1421 01:23:48,400 --> 01:23:52,966 It's unbelievable. There's nothing like it. It's 1422 01:23:52,966 --> 01:23:57,599 incredible. It's a whole caravan of love notes. 1423 01:23:59,100 --> 01:24:02,633 That's what his music is. [Pauline]: We should have played 1424 01:24:02,633 --> 01:24:05,833 that in the beginning. No, no, Coltrane is 1425 01:24:05,933 --> 01:24:07,299 Coltrane was a good choice. 1426 01:24:09,333 --> 01:24:13,599 Stevie Wonder's love supreme, Coltrane's love supreme, Nina Simone loves 1427 01:24:13,600 --> 01:24:16,900 supreme. Kendrick Lamar got some love supreme. 1428 01:24:17,166 --> 01:24:21,132 Oh, yes, Erykah Badu got some love. We got a lot of love 1429 01:24:21,133 --> 01:24:24,233 supreme candidates here. So you chose the right one. 1430 01:24:24,233 --> 01:24:28,966 You chose the right one. [Gerald]: Well, brother West, I just 1431 01:24:28,966 --> 01:24:31,666 want to thank you. It's such an honor to be speaking 1432 01:24:31,666 --> 01:24:35,099 with you. Your brilliance is just out of this 1433 01:24:35,100 --> 01:24:36,933 world. So we thank you from the Black Student 1434 01:24:36,933 --> 01:24:42,466 Union. [Dr. West]: Well, I salute each and every one of you, the 1435 01:24:42,466 --> 01:24:45,666 whole student union, all the student body, but 1436 01:24:45,666 --> 01:24:48,166 especially the three of you all who come together 1437 01:24:48,166 --> 01:24:50,966 and sister Trinity, she's somewhere, though, where's sister Trinity, 1438 01:24:51,600 --> 01:24:56,433 where's her lovely face? [Trinity]: I'm right here. [Dr. West]: Oh, yes, there she is, 1439 01:24:56,433 --> 01:24:58,633 indeed, indeed. Oh, and we got our dear brother 1440 01:24:58,633 --> 01:25:03,399 too. We got our dear brother Gebru here. Brother 1441 01:25:03,500 --> 01:25:07,366 Gebru, good to see him again. He's been a force 1442 01:25:07,366 --> 01:25:10,666 for good, for good while. [Dr. Amanuel Gebru]: Thank you, Dr. West. 1443 01:25:12,866 --> 01:25:15,799 Ka Ren: Yeah, I just wanted to say thank you myself to you 1444 01:25:15,800 --> 01:25:19,400 for your time and your message and everything that 1445 01:25:19,400 --> 01:25:22,233 you had to say. It really touched me and it really, 1446 01:25:22,500 --> 01:25:25,633 you know, allowed me to sit and think about some 1447 01:25:25,633 --> 01:25:28,533 of these things and some of these questions. Now, 1448 01:25:28,533 --> 01:25:31,933 we're going to move on to Dr. Gebru for closing 1449 01:25:31,933 --> 01:25:36,999 remarks. [Dr. Gebru]: Wow, just so thank you, thank you, thank 1450 01:25:37,000 --> 01:25:40,400 you so much, Dr. West, for blessing us with your 1451 01:25:40,400 --> 01:25:43,700 presence, your powerful message, and your wisdom 1452 01:25:43,700 --> 01:25:47,366 today. What a way to close out Black History Month. 1453 01:25:48,066 --> 01:25:51,266 But most importantly, I hope that we continue to 1454 01:25:51,266 --> 01:25:54,032 have more open and courageous conversations about 1455 01:25:54,033 --> 01:25:58,633 race, diversity, inclusion in order to dismantle 1456 01:25:58,633 --> 01:26:02,533 systemic racism and improve the lives of Black 1457 01:26:02,533 --> 01:26:06,199 students, students of color, and everyone in this 1458 01:26:06,200 --> 01:26:08,800 world. I just want to just say a few thank yous 1459 01:26:08,800 --> 01:26:11,733 and acknowledgements. I want to once again really 1460 01:26:11,733 --> 01:26:13,733 acknowledge our student leaders from the Moorpark 1461 01:26:13,733 --> 01:26:19,033 College BSU, Gerald, Pauline, Trinity, and Ka Ren, your 1462 01:26:19,033 --> 01:26:22,333 vision, your leadership, to bring Dr. West to our 1463 01:26:22,333 --> 01:26:26,399 district by working with our sister colleges. 1464 01:26:26,400 --> 01:26:29,333 Oxnard and Ventura speaks to your leadership and 1465 01:26:29,333 --> 01:26:32,466 ability to collaborate and put on such a dynamic 1466 01:26:32,466 --> 01:26:35,366 event like this. So thank you to our students and 1467 01:26:35,366 --> 01:26:38,699 just a few thank yous to the staff, faculty who were 1468 01:26:38,700 --> 01:26:42,033 involved in supporting our BSU students all year 1469 01:26:42,033 --> 01:26:45,333 round, especially for helping make this event by 1470 01:26:45,333 --> 01:26:47,999 supporting them and helping them execute a 1471 01:26:48,000 --> 01:26:50,200 phenomenal event. So thank you to our staff and 1472 01:26:50,200 --> 01:26:54,633 faculty as well. But a special thank you to two of 1473 01:26:54,633 --> 01:26:58,166 their advisors, Ms. Banea Sumpter, Professor Tammy 1474 01:26:58,166 --> 01:27:02,066 Coleman, who provide mentorship and leadership. 1475 01:27:02,400 --> 01:27:04,800 And thank you for for being the backbone of our 1476 01:27:04,800 --> 01:27:07,466 students and believing in them and believing in 1477 01:27:07,466 --> 01:27:10,466 their vision. And then last but not least, I 1478 01:27:10,466 --> 01:27:12,666 couldn't say enough thank you to our student 1479 01:27:12,666 --> 01:27:15,466 leaders and our moderators today. This was a 1480 01:27:15,466 --> 01:27:20,666 student led, student facilitated. You know, Gerald, Pauline, 1481 01:27:20,666 --> 01:27:25,699 Ka Ren, and Trinity, you're phenomenal leaders. And 1482 01:27:25,833 --> 01:27:28,433 for you to sit in the same space as Dr. West and 1483 01:27:28,433 --> 01:27:30,633 to be able to do this and engage in the 1484 01:27:30,633 --> 01:27:34,266 conversation speaks volumes to you who you are 1485 01:27:34,266 --> 01:27:37,832 and you as students and as leaders, and for 1486 01:27:37,833 --> 01:27:41,133 your advocacy for equity and social justice. But once 1487 01:27:41,133 --> 01:27:43,866 again, thank you, Dr. West. Thank you to the one 1488 01:27:43,866 --> 01:27:47,399 thousand plus attendees who are in attendance to 1489 01:27:47,400 --> 01:27:49,966 hear your words and be blessed by your presence. 1490 01:27:50,266 --> 01:27:52,932 And we appreciate you being with us today. And 1491 01:27:52,933 --> 01:27:55,299 hopefully we learned so much from today and that we 1492 01:27:55,300 --> 01:27:58,433 carry it on to our day to day moving forward. So 1493 01:27:58,433 --> 01:28:00,699 have a great day, everyone, and thank you once 1494 01:28:00,700 --> 01:28:01,066 again. 1495 01:28:03,300 --> 01:28:06,300 Dr. West: Thank you, my dear brother. We thank distinguished 1496 01:28:06,300 --> 01:28:10,033 Professor Coleman and all the others who 1497 01:28:10,033 --> 01:28:13,566 facilitate this and the young people, I'm leaving 1498 01:28:13,566 --> 01:28:19,899 with joy in my soul and a smile on my face. [Pauline]: Thank 1499 01:28:19,900 --> 01:28:23,200 you so much, Dr. West. [Tamarra Coleman]: Thank you Dr. West, it's an honor to 1500 01:28:23,200 --> 01:28:23,833 be here with you.